SCOTLAND - "First step" now on the cards to UK BAN

[Chuck]

Charlotte, that might have happened when common sense was around, not now.

Salmond is using a dead kid to get votes - no other reason for his plans to ban airguns ( no doubt followed by firearms) - they aren't a problem here.

Mike, you said it ... tesnews

[Burner]

They are controling Air guns because of a child that died 7 years ago?
You people allow these power hungry despots to stay in office?
How? Why?

I ask you this, how many have died from misuse of a air gun in the past 100 years?
2? 3?
Sure it is possible with that one lucky one in a billion shot, but highly improbable

[IainWR]

Hi all

I was born and grew up to age 22 in Aberdeen. My first five years military service after training were in northern Scotland. I am a near exact contemporary in Scottish education of both Tony Blair and Alex Salmond. I apologise profusely for my failure to organise the appropriate level of removal behind the bike sheds and administration of the appropriate level of violence.

Having said that, I think it is difficult to understand what is going on in Scotland now unless you have lived there for an extended period. It may be that you need to have gone to school there. Features of Scotland that Blair, Salmond and I all enjoyed:

Play ground bullying - there was a boy called Campbell in my class. Historically, the Campbell clan (government troops) went in the late 1600s to Glencoe to deal with the resident MacDonalds (cattle thieves of some renown). The Campbells received the traditional hospitality - in highland Scotland you do not refuse a man a bed (he will die of cold in the open overnight). In the early hours the Campbells woke, assembled as a military force, and solved the rustling problem by killing all of the men of the MacDonald clan and burning the women and children out of their homes. Most of the women and children indeed died of cold in the night. Scotland has never forgiven the Clan Campbell and that poor child was beaten up on a regular basis for something that happened 300 years ago.

Misplaced sentimentality: while rigorously punishing the smallest misbehaviour of their children with the "scud" (the leather punishment tool technically known as a tawse) applied across the palm of the hand, Scotland's teachers and parents in public would denounce the slightest risk to "our bairns" and grossly over-react to minimal threats - there was a huge campaign in Aberdeen when the "branders" (grids over the roadside drains) were replaced with ones with bars parallel to rather than across the direction of traffic - "our bairns" will be tragically injured when the front wheels of their bikes fall into the slots (happened to me - bike not bent, me not hurt)

Mindless low-level violence: The central belt of Scotland - a thirty-mile deep strip starting west of Edinburgh (posh c**ts) and ending east of Dunoon (posh c**ts) contained 2 million people and some of the most depressing standards of living in the free world. Poor people with appalling health and disgusting government-provided accommodation routinely settled disputes with brute force in the absence of police forces that frankly were not interested in the results of social deprivation. I must point out that this is a slightly second-hand impression: Aberdeen (100 miles further north) is an elegant city and has enough natural hardship (57 degrees north - beyond a lot of Alaska and well beyond Moscow - first point of arrival in UK of the winter East wind off the Russian steppes, home port of the UK Arctic trawling fleet before the EU wrecked it) that Aberdonians have a healthy respect for causes of misery.

A visceral and subconcious hatred of the English. Stirling Bridge, Bannockburn, Sherrifmuir, Killiekrankie (twice - years apart) Flodden, Prestonpans, Culloden, the Clearances and more - I was formally taught and informally replayed (remember that poor Campbell kid - he was the loser in more replayed wars than the critical incident) all of these glorious victories / treacherous defeats. Thus, the simple fact the English don't agree is enough to justify to the median Scottish voter any crackpot idea that Salmond comes up with.

Salmond, following a tradition that contains some genuine and heroic defenders of freedom – eg Wallace, Bruce, Winnie Ewing, has promised the Scots that all their problems will be solved if they get rid of the English yoke. From which it follows that doing anything differently from the English will make things better. Remember that Salmond is a truly expert politician – he achieves differentials between personality and reality that Tony Bliar has only ever dreamt of. Scotland has a historic problem with stupid children of the central belt dross using airguns to inflict mindless cruelty on cats and dogs (did I mention that the Scots are an appallingly sentimental tribe?). And suddenly some poor child died because of callous and reckless misuse of an airgun, just around the time the SNP look like winning power. Salmond leaps on the bandwagon (he's a good bandsman - a fine player of the pink oboe) and in amongst many other sentiment-driven issues, winds people up to a frenzy over a piece of trivia that he can influence and has only positive values in votes.

Salmond is an expert at manipulating the visceral attitudes inculcated into every Scot by the harshness of the Scottish environment and the skewed and romanticised view of history both taught in Scottish schools and ingrained in Scottish culture.

And add Dunblane. A pathetic paedophile was allowed to possess guns despite the advice of honest and decent people, and in 1996 murdered sixteen children in a most vile manner. Every newspaper and broadcaster in the UK poured vitriol on firearms owners. The Scottish reaction was one of the most disgraceful episodes of media rabblerousing in history - I hope (but doubt) that it is taught in journalist ethics classes. The stupid in Scotland (and they are legion - given all the magnificent arts, science and philosophy that has flowed from our small country one must ask if there is something about us Scots that pushes us towards both ends of the mental spectrum) lapped it up and have retained it.

I fear that Scotland is a lost cause as regards firearms ownership by private citizens. There is no appreciation that safety cannot be legislated, or that civilisation is not within the capacity of laws to create.

I'm staying in England, and if the bloody murdering rapacious English won't have me, would Canada (Connaught), Australia (Belmont) or New Zealand (Trentham) accept a man loyal to his origins who has been rejected by the country he loved?

Iain

[kennyc]

that was a truly awesome summing up!

[Sandgroper]

Iain,
After being in Scotland since '97 I can see exactly where you are coming from. Now that I've left the Prison Service, and back in study, I've given my family a warning order that we could be moving (Canada, NZ or back to Oz) if I'm accepted into Uni and get my degree.

As Campbell myself, your retelling of Glencoe is slightly inaccurate, but it doesn't bother me in the slightest. I must admit I took great delight in reminding the SNP supporters at work, that in the '45 more Scots fought for the Govt than the Jacobites - that never went down well! :55:

[Chuck]

Ian, damn good post sir. As long as the Scottish masses have football, beer and the bookies they don't give a sh1t about anything. As for the "English" bit, you got that to a "T"!

Salmond and the Scottish Numpty Party should be banned, along with his cohort McArsekill (does he not have a conviction for some firearms misbehaviour)?

[Mr_Logic]

But here's a thing with Scotland. The truly terrifying thing is that for some reason, Westminster politicians are letting Salmond dictate the referendum! It's mad.

Simply put England needs Scotland just as much as Scotland needs England. Differing reasons, but we need to keep this working. Salmond should have been dealt with - We hear your demands for a referendum and we are having one. It is for 18+. The question is, Do you want an independent Scotland?

But no.

We give him 2+ years to prepare, allow 16 year olds a vote (why? Too young to make an informed decision. Easy to see from Salmond's PoV - impressionable!) and only just about keep a straight question. The whole thing is madness.

[Mike357]

The SNP are managing themselves too turn the public against them. NATO and EU membership blunders have cost them votes.
I will stake my cats life on the them losing the referendum and possibly the next election!

[dromia]

Up in my part of the country he certainly isn't popular with the locals, surprisingly he seems to have the most support amongst the english incomers! wtfwtf

From what I see and hear up here there is no relish for independence, devolution of power yes, leave the union no. People have voted SNP in the past for greater devolution but will not vote for independence.

As Mike has said Salmond's continued cock ups with regards to Europe is working against him even in the potentially pro independence voting pool. They might like the idea of it but have little confidence in politicians of any colour to be able to step up to the mark and see it through, they know it will be hard and Britain doesn't have politicians of the high enough calibre to see it through.

With the SNP it is a case of "be careful what you wish for as it might just come true". They have got the referendum but they will loose it and that will be the end of the SNP.

[shotgun sam]

Name added
Sam