Springfield 1903

[TomEnfield]

Guys I'm looking at buying a Springfield 1903.
What should I be looking for when inspecting the rifle?
What's a decent price for one?
Any top tips for them?

[bnz41]

Hi,
Read this first.
http://www.byswordandmusket.co.uk/fac-r ... -failures/

Did you want a 1903 WW1 0r a 1903A3 WWII Not seen many 03's for sale will be well over £1500+ 03A3's should be more about again 1000+ Some have been made up from drill rifles to fire again, not sure if they are any good. Some were made into sniper rifle copies.

Dealer above tends to be in the upper price scale for anything 03/A3

[dromia]

Unfortunately proofing doesn't guarantee safety, all it means is that the gun took the over pressure proof round at that time.

However the proof round idea was created to check for inherent weaknesses in the metal used in days when it was locally made and could have weakening voids or slag in it, so perhaps in this case the proof round may have some merit although personally I wouldn't trust our proof houses as far as I'd throw the Rock Island arsenal.

These failures are real for whatever reason and are well documented and researched in the US, it was their problem and they addressed it and personally I'd go with the US warnings rather than the proof house wafflings, interesting that for all their twaddle on proving guns safe they still put in the caveat "they state that there is as much chance of a failure with the 1903 as with any other rifle of its vintage".

My own 1903 is out with the band of warned receivers and I deliberately looked for a "safe" example when I was 03 chasing and they were selling then for less than half of what they are going for now.

Like all fine guns that are no longer made as they become scarce and the price rises then the parts assemblers passing their wares as genuine period made guns get in on the act.

I have no problem with parts guns well made so long as they as sold as such and not tried to be passed of as what they aren't, I've seen many modern assembled and re-stamped guns over the years Mausers, Enfields and Springfields especially sniper versions being passed off as "genuine", Springfield prices now make this a worthwhile endeavour especially as these iconic rifles are now much sought after in the states and demand a premium as their supply dries up. 03/A3s are currently the version with the most make ups due no doubt to the greater availability of parts than for the 03.

So caveat emptor, for these types of guns you really need to do do your home work and research so that you can be as sure as you can be of the provenance of any gun you are looking at, I'd recommend the following reading The Book of the Springfield by Crossman and Hatchers Notebook by Julian S Hatcher as good source material.

Prices are around what Neil said in the above post.

[ovenpaa]

Like all fine guns that are no longer made as they become scarce and the price rises then the parts assemblers passing their wares as genuine period made guns get in on the act.

I have no problem with parts guns well made so long as they as sold as such and not tried to be passed of as what they aren't, I've seen many modern assembled and re-stamped guns over the years Mausers, Enfields and Springfields especially sniper versions being passed off as "genuine", Springfield prices now make this a worthwhile endeavour especially as these iconic rifles are now much sought after in the states and demand a premium as their supply dries up. 03/A3s are currently the version with the most make ups due no doubt to the greater availability of parts than for the 03.

So caveat emptor, for these types of guns you really need to do do your home work and research so that you can be as sure as you can be of the provenance of any gun you are looking at, I'd recommend the following reading The Book of the Springfield by Crossman and Hatchers Notebook by Julian S Hatcher as good source material..

I would personally take this a stage further and avoid purchasing any of the 'iconic' scarcer service rifles of the last century. For many years I wanted to own a Mauser sniper and the more I looked the more copied/faux/forged/upgraded versions I found until the point came where I was no longer prepared to take the risk on buying made in a garage somewhere as opposed to original issue. This decision was confirmed when I eventually had the chance to shoot to original early examples in Europe a few years ago. They were both of known provenance and both in German hands. One shot badly, the other was stunningly accurate at 400m

The same applies to the M1903 sniper variants and I know of two sources here in the UK that will build you faithful copies, correct in every aspect. Fine if you buy them for what they are however once they are moved on into the system their origin becomes muddied and before long they are being described as 'originals'

It reminds me of a conversation I had with an armourer from Warminster a few years ago who told me a story of how someone arrived at the Infantry & Small Arms School Corps Weapons Collection one day and asked where a specific rifle was, when he was told it had been moved on he was surprised and amused and said it was one of the finest forgeries he had ever seen. So even the 'experts' are being duped these days.

I personally make the occasional very hard to find part for my own rifles however I make very sure they will never be confused with originals, a good example being my P14 fine vernier rear sight, perfect in every way other than the sight is quite clearly marked as an Eddystone so it can never be accepted as an original.

Buyer beware is my view and as Dromia says, research your choice of rifle very carefully.

[froggy]

Buyer beware is my view and as Dromia says, research your choice of rifle very carefully.
and never trust the seller, however "reputable" he may be, disregard all his arguments and look at the rifle on its own merits based on the info/research you collected. Two pairs of eyes is better than one and personally I always run the piece by other collectors, usually much more knowledge able than me, in case I have missed something out.

[huntervixen]

without referencing back through my notes, wasn't it certain pre WW1 examples that had brittle receivers and were whole sale scrapped in the 1920's?

With regard to building a sniper A4, I have a superb A4 build, (based on a 1942 Remington A3 action and barrel and fitted with a NOS post war bolt with large safety lug), outfitted with a Lyman Alaskan and original Keystone C stock, lovely rifle to own and shoot.


Not one of the Gibbs builds, but built up by a gunsmith in the States and imported back in 2000.

[dromia]

Like all fine guns that are no longer made as they become scarce and the price rises then the parts assemblers passing their wares as genuine period made guns get in on the act.

I have no problem with parts guns well made so long as they as sold as such and not tried to be passed of as what they aren't, I've seen many modern assembled and re-stamped guns over the years Mausers, Enfields and Springfields especially sniper versions being passed off as "genuine", Springfield prices now make this a worthwhile endeavour especially as these iconic rifles are now much sought after in the states and demand a premium as their supply dries up. 03/A3s are currently the version with the most make ups due no doubt to the greater availability of parts than for the 03.

So caveat emptor, for these types of guns you really need to do do your home work and research so that you can be as sure as you can be of the provenance of any gun you are looking at, I'd recommend the following reading The Book of the Springfield by Crossman and Hatchers Notebook by Julian S Hatcher as good source material..

I would personally take this a stage further and avoid purchasing any of the 'iconic' scarcer service rifles of the last century.

Any build guns assembled by a maker of any integrity would have their work stamped as such.

I have seen the odd one so marked, what that says about the rest of the gun trade is up to your own interpretation.

[rufrdr]

Just as an FYI, the argument rages in the U.S. about the low number receivers: have all that were going to fail, failed by now, or are there still some in circulation just waiting to let go? The low number receivers are strong but brittle. Some have cracked simply by dropping them from a height onto a concrete floor. The failures in use seemed to happen when a catastrophic base failure occurred with a defective case. Some U.S. military ammunition made during WW1 by inexperienced contractors was notorious for poor quality and experienced base failures which wrecked some low number 03s.

Personally I would never shoot a low number 03 but then many are used here on a regular basis by owners who are blissfully ignorant of the potential danger. The U.S. government continued to issue low number 03s through WW2.

Look luck on your search for an '03. There are many variants with their own interesting history and worth collecting.