Hauptman wrote:If you're not, then open the bolt fully, give the whole thing a gentle side to side shake and try again. If that fails, then tip the round out and start again.
This can be a real pain - But like yourself I have no intention of parting with such a lovely and accurate rifle...
...I've come to the conclusion that I will just have to master the technique of loading it efficiently as part of my normal routine.
Another aspect of this issue, is that while you should not hesitate to challenge anyone walking around with their bolt closed, you should make sure you're right before interrupting someone actually on the point....
....a few years back I was shooting at the Trafalgar - there were 3 of us shooting on the point, and the guy marking my card was a bit of a pain - he was obviously scrutinising me, and at one point started to tell me off because I raised my rifle while unloading - I pointed out to him that the '4 degree rule' was for 'loaded' rounds, but he persisted, asking how I knew the round wasn't live...I said that the loud bang and target going down was a bit of a give away...
...In the end I had to tell him to either report me to an RCO, or shut up - the other guy shooting with us also told him to be quite, which was a relief, as it was becoming a bit embarrassing.
Unfortunately this is an all-too-common problem. Karen had it during the Imperial - some bloke who claimed to have done the RCO course and objected to her loading the rifle first and picking it up afterwards.
I encourage everyone to read the rules on this with care. It's Section 61 of the NRA Handbook (the Bisley Bible) (downloadable from the NRA website) and it runs to 3 A6 pages - not a lot really for all of the critical safety rules.
Iain: I was confused as to what sparked the debate, but on reading this, was it the fact that a round can be loaded whilst the rifle is horizontal but not shouldered and then picked up, as the Handbook (atleast the edition I quoted) seems to conflict.... or is that as you said, what sparked the debate? I was a bit confused as to what happened where!
Unfortunately this is an all-too-common problem. Karen had it during the Imperial - some bloke who claimed to have done the RCO course and objected to her loading the rifle first and picking it up afterwards.
I encourage everyone to read the rules on this with care. It's Section 61 of the NRA Handbook (the Bisley Bible) (downloadable from the NRA website) and it runs to 3 A6 pages - not a lot really for all of the critical safety rules.
Iain
Thanks for that reminder Iain - I've just read the section - rule 257 does seem open to interpretation...personally I'll stick to closing the bolt with the rifle aimed at the target, as I'm still not keen on loading the rifle on the ground first.
I see rule 264 broken occasionally - We had a discussion about this issue at our AGM a few years ago, and decided to make breech flags compulsory, even with the bolt removed...not because we felt it made things any safer...but so that other clubs 50 feet away could see we were being safe...
You are quoting the RCO Instruction Manual (I think - if I am wrong in that there is a bigger problem that I haven't identified and please tell me so). That is not definitive. I am referring to the NRA Handbook, Rules of Shooting etc, which is definitive. The differences are small but actually significant. I am glad that this thread has brought the differences to the NRAs attention - we will rewrite the RCO document asap and issue corrections.
Having followed the thread I am now confused. If I understand it right, it is acceptable under the NRA rules to load (i.e. close the bolt on a live round) with the rifle out of the shoulder, and then bring it up on aim? So long as the rifle remains "horizontal" for the purposes of the 3 degree rule, throughout?
Unfortunately this is an all-too-common problem. Karen had it during the Imperial - some bloke who claimed to have done the RCO course and objected to her loading the rifle first and picking it up afterwards.
I encourage everyone to read the rules on this with care. It's Section 61 of the NRA Handbook (the Bisley Bible) (downloadable from the NRA website) and it runs to 3 A6 pages - not a lot really for all of the critical safety rules.
Iain
Thanks for that reminder Iain - I've just read the section - rule 257 does seem open to interpretation...personally I'll stick to closing the bolt with the rifle aimed at the target, as I'm still not keen on loading the rifle on the ground first.
I see rule 264 broken occasionally - We had a discussion about this issue at our AGM a few years ago, and decided to make breech flags compulsory, even with the bolt removed...not because we felt it made things any safer...but so that other clubs 50 feet away could see we were being safe...
From observation at Siberia in particular, it seems a fair number of people use a breech flag but do not attempt to remove the bolt.
shugie wrote:From observation at Siberia in particular, it seems a fair number of people use a breech flag but do not attempt to remove the bolt.
That's right shugie - and that's absolutely fine - you can, by the rules, either remove your bolt OR use a breach flag...both are safe ways of guaranteeing the rifle is safe.
The only reason why we made breach flags compulsory, even with the bolt removed, is that breach flags are obvious even from a distance, where as it can be difficult to see if a bolt is removed from a distance...
- I've just read the section - rule 257 does seem open to interpretation...personally I'll stick to closing the bolt with the rifle aimed at the target, as I'm still not keen on loading the rifle on the ground first.