Maximum and minimum coal for lead handgun ammo

[bradaz11]

why not just set a pair of verniers to a set measurement, lock them at that point, and use them as a guide? too sloppy = too short. wont go in = too long

also, as for not using the press corectly, if you are not doing full strokes on a progressive, wont that lead to other issues, as if you don't go fully up once, one bullet won't be crimped sufficiently, one not seated and one not charged properly??

It isn't about the force you use, its about bottoming out the shell holder on most presses isn't it? you can do it as hard as you like, but once the ram is on the bottom of the die, all you are doing is flexing the handle

[zanes]

Jesus man, you're over thinking the issue. If your rounds load ok and cause no problems I'd do some load development if you haven't already as that's a sure way to improve accuracy and then practice. You'll find bigger improvements by doing that rather than faff about with seating depth for your Underlever.

+1. What sort of groups are you getting?

I also think you're slightly missing the point of a progressive press (and yes, I use one) if you're getting worked up about 7 thou OAL variation.

[WelshShooter]

With lead bullets you can usually work off the canelure to give you a good idea of what sort of overall length you should achieve. With my Marlin .357 I seated some lead bullets at different lengths, increasing in length in steps of 0.005" until the action would not cycle. Once I found this, I just used the overall length of the cartridge before and used that as a standard. I can't remember the exact length as it's been quite a while since I've loaded some, but I reckon it was around the ~1.59" mark. This was mostly to ensure good cycling of the action rather than improve accuracy as the handloads I have are already pretty accurate.

[Dougan]

I'm using a lee crimp die on the last stage and crimping so the case closes in just behind the foremost edge of the cannelure

Which is what most folk do, and the cannelures are positioned (assuming they're well made) where they are for correct seating depth for the caliber - If after seating them correctly, as you are doing, the COAL is too long or short and causing feeding problems, then you would need to change your bullet rather than playing with the COAL...

...out of curiosity, I've just measured 10 of my .357 rounds - They averaged at 1561", with a spread of 6 thou...they were made for practice, so not with any particular attention to perfect seating...so as long as your happy with the average COAL of your rounds, then I wouldn't worry about what is likely to be very little variation in a batch.

[Dustyman]

Thanks for your comments gents (ladies ? ) however it's seem the thread has drifted a bit from my original need ,
I have no issue with the accuracy of my loads or the actual COAL , all loads have been worked up to twenty yards , off hand shooting and on a good day if I'm getting it right I can put in an inch and half group which I'm happy with on open sights . What I'm really looking for is more of a quick quality control check but without the verniers as mentioned ( had considered that option but thank you anyway)
Therefore assuming the tolerance of the press and materials give me a spread of say 7-8tho , 3-4 tho around a mean , would that be the tolerance I should use for the quick go / no go gauges I was thinking about or would I be able to use a wider tolerance for quick checking of the lengths in batches of built cartridges ? That's the tolerance question I was asking , just to pick up when the press is playing up or I have a problem , . I would easily make and use a hundred on a night so just trying to simplify the checking without having to meSure each ( as I do on my other centre fires ) these are less critical but more for enjoyment so I'm not after super accurate but also want to stay sensibly safe .

Or am I trying to simplify it too much and should stick with the verniers ? Thanks

[zanes]

I have no issue with the accuracy of my loads or the actual COAL , all loads have been worked up to twenty yards , off hand shooting and on a good day if I'm getting it right I can put in an inch and half group which I'm happy with on open sights [..] these are less critical but more for enjoyment so I'm not after super accurate but also want to stay sensibly safe .

I still think you're worrying over nothing- 6 thou OAL variation won't see you running into safety issues and you're happy with their accuracy.

Why add another layer of work/complication/worry?

Edit: This isn't one of these wind up threads is it?

[WelshShooter]

It's easier if you just set up your seating die correctly. Adjust the seating die and measure you bullet, if it's not what you want then make adjustments to seating depth and re-measure until you're happy. Lock the stem down using a wrench or similar and then measure the next 3-5 that are seated to ensure it's repeatable. Then don't bother with measurements after that as you'd expect bullets to be seated to the same depth every time.

[Dustyman]

No wind up but I think I must be putting this over wrong . When using a progressive press it throws the finished cartridge out into a tray , the whole point being I can fly thro a load of rounds quickly as there's less manual work so I use these presses for my pistol caliber s I'm not taking every round out by hand and wanting to measure each and since the loading is done quite quickly , I don't want to be catching each round and checking it . I'm more than happy with the 7-8 tho variation in what I make but if something is not quite right and for some reason the press or i do something wrong I don't want to carry on merrily making a hundred or more rounds to then find something is wrong and have to sit down with the kinetic hammer for the nigbt stripping them . So rather than measuring every say Every tenth by vernier I wanted to make a fixed go / no go . So what tolerance above the 7-8 difference should I Make these guages to or should use that 7-8 variation as my tolerance . Hope that's clearer ,

[WelshShooter]

I must be using calipers wrong because it only takes me 5 seconds to perform a measurement... I would imagine hard gauging with go/no-go gauges would be more time consuming?

As per my above post, you will not have any variation in the press if your dies are set up and locked correctly. You should be using the full stroke of the press for all operations (unless the instructions state otherwise) to remove any variablilty in the system.

Once I've installed my seating die I only measure the first 3 bullets and the last one per batch of 50 to ensure that the die has not loosened through seating (my RCBS seating die tends to "loosen" itself over time as the lock ring screw is crap). I really do think you're overcomplicating something that is quite simple.

[bradaz11]

what is wrong with locking the vernier out to a certain measurement to turn it into a go / no go? pick a measurement just above your seating depth - like 4 thou, and off you go...

bearing in mind, you could probably have a difference of 40 thou (1mm) and have no issue.