Making the case for a Section 2 licensing system

[Gaz]

Pretty much all of us agree that a section 2 licensing system, where all the needless paperwork around variations and so on is gotten rid of, is the way ahead. Given that ACPO stated back in 2010 that they want to see "a single licensing system" in the next revision of the Firearms Act, we might be able to steal a march on them by building up support for a section 2 system. (hey, a man can dream)

So, what are the arguments in favour of a section 2-style system? Starter for ten, the system should focus on licensing individuals and not inanimate objects.

[saddler]

Works in New Zealand & they have a higher %age of the population owning firearms

[Demonic69]

Much less overhead required in terms of staff, less paperwork required for both FLO and licensee, (following the ACPO and HO logic) people are more likely to make sure they're up to date.

[Sandgroper]

Sorry to put a dampener on things, but I mentioned all of that a few months ago when I e-mailed the HO about the proposed fee increase and got a resounding, Thanks, but no thanks, from them.

It might be different with a concerted effort...

[DW58]

Many European countries use a system whereby the individual and not the firearms are licensed, most have lower gun crime figures than us, so the evidence is there that it works. The current system dating from 1968 is archaic and impractical, but what will it take for the Home Office to take note?

We all know that the massive administrative log-jam within the licensing system is as a result of an inoperable system, but will they admit it - pigs might fly.

[Demonic69]

We need to get behind it and spin it the right way, it's all about saving costs and helping make the system run smoother and safer. Then we need to push it into our clubs and national bodies. THEY opened this door by trying to turn the public against us, using the "subsidised rich shooters" routine, now is our chance to turn that around.

[DaveT]

Makes huge sense and individual guns still recorded (purchase / transfer) ....just no great admin overhead re variations.

Not sure how usage handled though...Ie 'I want it for target or game'......would you allow a 50 cal for rabbits etc debate.

[Demonic69]

Just allow you the guns you're approved for based on need (not want Chucky, we're not Neanderthal ;-).
Join the 50 club, get it added etc.

[Chapuis]

Gaz I think most of us understand what you mean when you say "making the case for a section 2 licensing system". You mean a single tier licensing system rather than numerous tiers as it is today? Many of us at present having both a section 1 firearms certificate and a section 2 shotgun certificate.

You will be glad to know that ACPO have also long advocated a single tier system. Unfortunately this is where you differ as while you are suggesting a single tier system with controls and requirements similar to those for the present shotgun certificate system, ACPO are suggesting the reverse by bringing the requirements and controls for a section 2 shotgun certificate in line with those of a section 1, effectively tightening the control on shotguns and shotgun certificate holders.

While it is my belief that most shooters agree that the present licensing system is burdensome and overly complicated and should be replaced, some of the shooting organisations are quite happy with the present silly system as it is riddled with loopholes and inconsistencies making successful prosecutions for infringements difficult. In fact a representative from BASC told me just that some time ago. His remarks was on the lines of "be careful of what you wish for" and " better the devil you know than the devil you don't".

[Maggot]

The system is lousy thats for sure.

The way to spin it at the moment is a business case.

How will it improve the system and public safety, while being more efficient?

The problem you will have here is it will almost certainly involve some sort of medical statement (not needed for a rifle, it is what it is, but now we are talking about the person) about which we will have the usual howls of indignation.

Cuts are the big issue, and I dont think that we, the license holders, are way up there.

A while back I approched my boss regarding inviting Andy Marsh for a target type shoot and a chat. My boss was fine with it but it never went any further as it went into the too difficult box as regards the range side.

If you/we can prove that there will be a tangible improvement in the above we might get listened to.

I dont think the actual licensing offices would disagree, its getting at the HO via them I guess, but as they (licensing authorities) all have their own opinion on the way to do things it will take an age.

I reckon though the licensing process will take longer if it involves the NHS etc.