Future of Competition Shooting

[Chuck]

What are the real answers? I don't really know but encouraging more people to actually shoot competitions might help. Also for the TR shooters and the F Class to stop bitching about each other and just get on and respect each others discipline. Neither discipline is 'better' than the other, just different but both with the same aim of putting holes in the 'V' Bull.

Snobbery will kill the sport..And we need another place, not just BISLEY! It is a disgrace that Bisley is the HOME of British shooting..for the G&T brigade.....Why quibble at a £1.00 a roiund when people may have to drive across the UK to get there, fuel is expensive too.

IMO ammo is not the cost but actually getting to that place for a LOT of would be competitors is just out of the question.

[IainWR]

The home of British shooting has to be somewhere. We, the current generation, inherited Bisley and have a duty to keep it and pass it on to future generations. Please explain why Bisley is a disgrace - you obviously feel strongly enough that you have to shout about it. I haven't drunk a G&T in over a year, and I more or less live at Bisley. About a third of the population of the UK live within 3 hours of Bisley - not enough and not close enough but it's what we have and it's difficult to better given the geography and demography of the UK. Agreed we might improve a little on that number if the National Shooting Centre was somewhere up the M40 just south of Birmingham, but it isn't, and there is no chance of having the money to move it to make that possible slight gain.

Snobbery will kill the sport, you say. Who are the snobs? I never met any. Tell us the names.

Iain
Grammar school boy, Graduate of a Scottish University and the Open University, joined the military and stayed in the same rank for 32 years, drives a 15 year old Vauxhall, Captain of Great Britain TR Team.

[rox]

The NRA Imperial Meeting is in decline and the format has to change.
Target Rifle shooters are, in the main, scornful of 'F' class shooting.

I think there’s actually a certain amount of reticence in both directions, but fortunately they are an ignorant minority. I’ve always taken an active interest in F Class, and have plenty of good friends who shoot the discipline; I enjoy shooting with them, and I’ve enjoyed following and supporting the major F Class events. When I was organising the Easter meeting I made it my priority to understand the past problems of combined F Class and TR meetings, and to make the Easter Meeting as good as it could be for F Class shooters. By all accounts everyone enjoyed it, and with a bit of luck many people learned a bit more about ‘the other side’ and gained a bit more respect for each other. F Class has definitely evolved and is headed in its own direction, which is great. I think that Easter proved that combined meetings are still interesting, worthwhile and viable. If that ceases to be the case (e.g. if F Class cease to shoot short range) then so be it - there’s no reason why different disciplines need to be forced together if there is little common ground.

It was particularly pleasing to see so many visitors from mainland Europe at the F Class Europeans. In many European countries access to long distance ranges is at least as difficult as it is in the UK – often much more difficult, so it’s great to attract them to our facilities. There’s a relatively tiny TR following in Europe, but some of them do come to shoot in the UK regularly (at least 5 times a year). Of course, the Imperial brings even more shooters from all over the world – mostly Commonwealth countries. Between our disciplines we’ve pretty much got it covered, and we hold World Championship titles in F Class, TR and 300 meters (apologies to any others I’ve forgotten).

What I think F Class may be missing is regular club team competitions. Team shooting does not seem to form such a core part of GB F Class competition, unlike TR in which club teams are out competing almost every available weekend of the season. Consequently the club teams feed the county teams feed the home-nations teams feed the GB teams feed the Palma teams. Since many club sides include seasoned internationals, newcomers have near-perfect team drill and discipline before they even get to county level. I’m sure that much of our strength at the highest level (5 out of the last 6 Palma titles) is built on this strong team foundation from club level upwards.

..

[John25]

And congratulations to the GB F-class teams winning both matches at the European Championships, coached by ...

Martin Townsend (past Captain and Chief Coach of winning World Championship TR Teams)
Jane Messer (Past Captain of GB TR Team, winner of the TR Grand Aggregate)
Bill Richards (Chief Coach for past GB TR teams, the acknowledged master at reading the wind on Stickledown)
Paul Kent (winner of the TR Grand Aggregate)

I really don't think shooters with a TR background have an attitude problem with F-class!

Iain

Iain, those you mention and a few more are enlightened, many are not; you should get out more. I started, like most of my contemporarys, with SR and moved to TR. I have moved to F class because, physically, it is a little easier.

Some TR shooters believe that the discipline itself is easier.

Jane, Martin, Bill and Paul know different because they are 'different', by that I mean open minded. (not to mention b good shots)

My ten years with the NRA, if it taught me nothing else, it taught me that many TR and MR shooters are dinosaurs.

The comet is coming :cheers:

[Chuck]

In ALL of the UK we have ONE major range complex like Bisley,..ah well you inherited it and it is tradition - so don't let progress get in the way of standing still eh!

It's that narrow thinking that harms shooting...the "MY ONE IS BEST SYNDROME"...jeez as someone said, it's about SHOOTING, who the hell cares what the discipline is because as long as there is this "snobbery" you are nailing the lid on your own coffin.

By all means have different disciplines but get real...the sport is NOT safe and ity needs numbers....

And as for the population, all the more reason to cater for those further afield and have some competition!

Oh and BTW, no names etc but some of the shooters I have met who are Bisley regulars are the most pompous anally retentive self important twats I have ever met..jeezuz they even cried cos they lost a wee fun Xmas shoot at 25 yards..FFS...threatening to report the matter to the NRA et al...get a life.

[Dougan]

So where would you put Bisley then Chuck? - As has already been said, it is well located geographically...just off the M25 and M3, close to the capital...only takes me 1.5 hours from all the way down ere...

You say 'why stand in the way of progress'? - As you know (actually when was the last time you were at Bisley?), Bisley has a historical feel about it.....a modern version just wouldn't be the same.

And you keep going on about 'snobbery', but the only person I'm hearing it from is yourself....

[Hauptman]

Dougan said: "Bisley has a historical feel about it.....a modern version just wouldn't be the same."

I agree 100%.......... despite the appalling "dunnees" and the potholes, not to mention the "greasy spoon" eateries, the place has a shabby genteel charm. I've not encountered any snobbery in my 5 years of regular attendance, a bit of stupidity maybe, but no snobbery..........

Covered firing points at 600 on Century would be REALLY nice for us old geezers, though....................

Hauptman

[Mr_Logic]

Hmm! Some good points raised.

Talking snobbery - take a shotgun, go and shoot at the NCSC, when you're unsure quite what's what.

Then repeat the process with a rifle out on Century. See where you get helped and where you get laughed at.

There is very little snobbery that I have seen with rifle stuff. In the summer I was at 300 on Century. On the next firing point were two students, I thinj a couple. He was very focused and didn't say a lot. She was bitching about all the TR gear they had to wear. Being an FTR shooter I just had to take the p*** as a I lay down in my T-shirt and shorts (yes, the one hot day we had this year).

She retorted, all very amicably, that it's so much easier for us F class shooters. But then did counter that with recognition that the target is quite dinky!

That good humoured exchange was about as much as I have seen. I don't think any issue exists between the classes.

The problem is cost and accessibility. If I want to play cricket, I call my local club, arrange a day to meet them and pitch up and play.

If I want to shoot, I call my local club, to find out that actually it is a 200 mile round trip, with a cost to shoot of 25 quid plus ammo in top for a cost of about 75 quid total. Then I find out that I must attend on a nominated guest day which might not be for months.

10 quid to play cricket up the road rather seems the better deal? Sort the price and make it accessible and people will shoot. Everyone I talk to would like a go but doesn't know where to start!

[Chuck]

well located for who exactly........not for anyone north of the border for sure...a bit more central??

[Mr_Logic]

Is Bisley ideal? No! But it is what it is!

Apparently there was a range down the road from me but it closed. Daventry is quite central...