What would a UK national shooting body look like.

[Sandgroper]

Good idea. You might want to start a separate thread to avoid any confusion!

[Blackstuff]

I agree with DaveT, that a National body representing shooting has to be prepared to fight the political fight.

It's core role should the the protection and advancement of all forms of shooting.

Having said that should that political fight be fought by the body itself (like the NRA in the US) or should it be affiliated with a Political Party or form it's own Political Party?

The Shooters and Fishers Party, who help hold the balance of power in NSW could be used a template for a political party. http://www.shootersparty.org.au/content.php/138

The problem is that the current FPTP voting system does not favour small niche parties. I would suggest that any National body should lobby hard as well as indicating to it's members who is the best MP to lobby and vote for - much in the same way BASC does.

As much as I admire the NRA in the US, any affiliation with them would be seen as negative here in the UK. Knowledge from them, on effective lobbying would be invaluable.

Getting a figurehead is a good idea, but it has to be someone unimpeachable and respected by all levels of society. They would also be someone that the media is unable to blank. A woman and/or ethical minority would be perfect - it would overturn stereotypes as well as forcing the media to be wary of changes of discrimination.

Going hand in hand with the political fight would be education. A strong and proactive Educational wing of the organisation is vital. I'll leave it there for the moment while I think on this some more. :-P

I don't want to sound disrespectful but I honestly don't know what the BSSC does?? It's website claims "The British Shooting Sports Council is an umbrella organisation representing the major shooting associations in the United Kingdom." Surely this is what we want but as yet i don't know who they are or what they actually do in real terms. Solidification of the BSSC into a member based organisation that also fights for shooting politically a la the US NRA would be the solution?

During the Cumbrian shootings the only organisation i saw was BASC (and yes i'm aware the NRA was doing plenty of leg work behind the scenes but a decision was made that the press would be dealt with by BASC), why wasn't it the BSSC? Was this a tactical decision because of the firearms used, or the more 'presentable' face of/easier to understand concept of game shooting or was it simply because BASC has its own media centre?? :G

Sorry for the slight derailment

[Sandgroper]

My own take would be that it would have to be member, grass roots driven especially within the existing organisations as from what I see the current leaders have too much vested interest to want to move change in a national direction.

As a start, what about every club, irrespective of size or discipline, elects a Club Representative (CR).

After that it gets a bit tricky as I want to avoid multiple layers of representation and I want members to have as direct access to those at the top as possible. I also want to avoid people wearing multiple hats - they have one job to do to the best of their ability.

Possibly, the CR's could then elect Regional Reps (RR) who then go on to form the National Council (NC) ?

I need to write this down rather than thinking about it as I write! :?

[Sandgroper]

I don't want to sound disrespectful but I honestly don't know what the BSSC does?? It's website claims "The British Shooting Sports Council is an umbrella organisation representing the major shooting associations in the United Kingdom." Surely this is what we want but as yet i don't know who they are or what they actually do in real terms. Solidification of the BSSC into a member based organisation that also fights for shooting politically a la the US NRA would be the solution?

During the Cumbrian shootings the only organisation i saw was BASC (and yes i'm aware the NRA was doing plenty of leg work behind the scenes but a decision was made that the press would be dealt with by BASC), why wasn't it the BSSC? Was this a tactical decision because of the firearms used, or the more 'presentable' face of/easier to understand concept of game shooting or was it simply because BASC has its own media centre?? :G

Sorry for the slight derailment

I don't know either. I know they are involved as experts with the UN ICAS small arms working group. Other than, that your guess is as good as mine.

Re: Cumbria. With all due respect to the NRA, if you look at the statements from BASC (during and after) you would be forgiven if you thought it was all BASC's idea from the start. No mention of speaking for other organisations, united front for shooting etc.
I suspect BASC took the opportunity with both hands and went for it. It doesn't bother me in the slightest as I'm a BASC member, but if I was a member of another organisation, I would be feeling confused and aggrieved.

[M99]

I don't want to sound disrespectful but I honestly don't know what the BSSC does?? It's website claims "The British Shooting Sports Council is an umbrella organisation representing the major shooting associations in the United Kingdom." Surely this is what we want but as yet i don't know who they are or what they actually do in real terms. Solidification of the BSSC into a member based organisation that also fights for shooting politically a la the US NRA would be the solution?

During the Cumbrian shootings the only organisation i saw was BASC (and yes i'm aware the NRA was doing plenty of leg work behind the scenes but a decision was made that the press would be dealt with by BASC), why wasn't it the BSSC? Was this a tactical decision because of the firearms used, or the more 'presentable' face of/easier to understand concept of game shooting or was it simply because BASC has its own media centre?? :G

Sorry for the slight derailment

I don't know either. I know they are involved as experts with the UN ICAS small arms working group. Other than, that your guess is as good as mine.

Re: Cumbria. With all due respect to the NRA, if you look at the statements from BASC (during and after) you would be forgiven if you thought it was all BASC's idea from the start. No mention of speaking for other organisations, united front for shooting etc.
I suspect BASC took the opportunity with both hands and went for it. It doesn't bother me in the slightest as I'm a BASC member, but if I was a member of another organisation, I would be feeling confused and aggrieved.

There is a very good article in the last (not this one) BASC magazine about the planning and preparation that had been put in place for just such an incident - from reading the article they just went straight out of the door (Literally) and got on to the press, radio etc and put across the stance of the shooting community - from reading the article, there was no mention of any other organisation input.

Mike

[Sandgroper]

I read that as well - interesting.

[Mike357]

One organisation that covers all areas of shooting, if it fires a projectile then it falls under the remit.

The organisation has sub committees that represent, those encompassed into the new organistaion such as BASC, CPSA, BSSC etc etc.

It charges a realistsic membership fee in return for showing a genuine return. For example you shoot free of fees at regional shooting centres (except clays). Bear in mind that golf clubs will charge several hundred pounds a year for membership! Further income from competitions held in a structured and regulated format.

A figurehead of national recognition but preferably not a serving politician.

Regional representative groups feed into a national rep that sits on the board.

All profits are reinvested in shooting assets!

Christ, where do you stop........................................

[spud]

i wish Heiniken would do it , cant be any worse and they would probably be the best shooting body in the world.

[FredB]

The basic assumption that a single organisation would be a good thing is wrong. If we had it, the moaners would be asking for devolution. The strength of the shooting sports lies in the diverse nature of what we do---we should recognise this as a potential strength, not a problem and build on it. What we have today is a culture of complainers, who want to snipe at "the other lot". Target rifle shooters call the Historical shooters "the funnies" and resent the presence of the clay shooters at Bisley. Pistol and Gallery Rifle shooters complain about Target Rifle shooters receiving a better service and facilities and so on. If we have enemies, all this serves them well and benefitsd us in no way. Join an association and make it strong. Most complainers about the NRA are not members and most of the stories that circulate, in my club at least, are pure and nasty fiction.
The BSSC is a forum for the National Organisations to talk together, exchange views and seek to understand each other. Our strength lies in the individual organisations. Join one and if you don't like it seek a position of influence and change it from the inside. Certain members appear to be doing just that at the NRA at present---judge them at the end of the re-shuffle, not part way through.
Fred

[Sandgroper]

The basic assumption that a single organisation would be a good thing is wrong. If we had it, the moaners would be asking for devolution. The strength of the shooting sports lies in the diverse nature of what we do---we should recognise this as a potential strength, not a problem and build on it. What we have today is a culture of complainers, who want to snipe at "the other lot". Target rifle shooters call the Historical shooters "the funnies" and resent the presence of the clay shooters at Bisley. Pistol and Gallery Rifle shooters complain about Target Rifle shooters receiving a better service and facilities and so on. If we have enemies, all this serves them well and benefitsd us in no way. Join an association and make it strong. Most complainers about the NRA are not members and most of the stories that circulate, in my club at least, are pure and nasty fiction.
The BSSC is a forum for the National Organisations to talk together, exchange views and seek to understand each other. Our strength lies in the individual organisations. Join one and if you don't like it seek a position of influence and change it from the inside. Certain members appear to be doing just that at the NRA at present---judge them at the end of the re-shuffle, not part way through.
Fred

I understand your point of view, but if we have culture of complainers - my question is, "What caused this to be?"

To me be it seems this "culture" has come about through the fractious nature of shooting in the UK. We do not seem to be pulling in the same direction, hence the sniping at each other.

I don't understand why a properly thought out organisation that caters for and promotes all forms of shooting is something to be afraid of. I can't see how all the different shooting organisations in the UK working to their own agenda helps improve the situation for all shooters.