GMP chief con: 'repealing handgun ban would boost crime'

[Gaz]

“The trouble is that even if we license handguns, we end up with more in the system,” he said.

“We know at the moment it's actually pretty hard to get a firearm in Manchester.

“We should all be grateful that we have got such tight gun control in this country – when you look at the States, it's awful over there.

“We should be pleased we have had the success we have had.”

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/ ... le-6594830

This man is a member of ACPO. I think it's about time we flushed out the views of the rest of them.

[Demonic69]

“The trouble is that even if we license handguns, we end up with more in the system,” he said.

What a bright spark that man is. Who's system, the one for crims or the one for us?

We know at the moment it's actually pretty hard to get a firearm in Manchester.

Uh-huh
From Firearm crime statistics - issued by the HoC, London, West Midlands and Manchester have the highest number of firearms offences in the country.

We should all be grateful that we have got such tight gun control in this country – when you look at the States, it's awful over there.

The gold old generalisation tactic, Murrica is evil and full of gun-toting rednecks. Let's ignore the actual facts shall we and move along

“We should be pleased we have had the success we have had.”

I agree, your figure-fudging is an asset to this country, more people may be dying and getting hurt/robbed,raped etc. but your exemplary tailoring of statistics makes it all come out looking rosy. Good on YOU.

[froggy]

Gaz,

I am very confused .
On one hand you are in favour of opposing even flushing out the views and lies from the "anti-gun" and on the other hand you crucify the very politician that sparked the debate enabling the "pro-licencing" side to put his arguments forward.

To me, it sounds like you simply hold anti-UKIP sentiments and that you are ready to twist this "gun-licensing" debate to further those sentiments ?

[Gaz]

UKIP is basically the Nigel Farage party. When he stumbles, support for them dips accordingly. I don't know if you've realised this, my garlic-chomping friend, but there are no pro-shooting voices in the media at the moment. We're not getting airtime to counter the negative views of Squires and the like, and ignorant journalists whose understanding of gun law stems from America are approvingly quoting antis and giving them column inches and airtime.

You think Farage has done us a favour. He hasn't. Thanks to him even the online polls on newspaper websites (which shooters tend to do well in) are turning against us.

Had he said "repeal the pistol ban" in a week where he hadn't been found out to be a lying idiot (denied having any knowledge of their 2010 manifesto even though he wrote the foreword), and he'd said it calmly and sensibly instead of as a throwaway line on a radio show, I wouldn't be slamming him. But he did neither of those so I'm happy to call him the fool he is.

[Dangermouse]

I have met several people who did not know that you could not shoot pistol here.

I think it should be every clubs responsibility to be getting as many new members through the doors as possible. I'm always amazed when i hear people are on waiting lists to join clubs, and they sre not always non FAC holders.

Too many old shooters in clubs, we need to even the balance an get more females in to shooting.

How many people do you know have "had a go" whilst on holiday but have never followed it up back home?

DM

[froggy]

Re-Gaz

Frankly, I can think of many liars & cretins in Westminter whith wrong timing that are doing very well... So to hang Farage high & dry in such a way is a very light and feeble argument .

The only fault I see so far is that the UK shooters have no representative body that is pushing the argument on their behave, unfortunatly making Farage's very valid comments an isolated one instead of a tool in a well constructed campaign.

Farage's mission statement is not gun ownership - it should be the UK shooting body' s one.
Euuuhhh ... BTW what is that UK shooting body saying ? Where is it ? Is there actually one ?

[Blackknight1974]

The problem is that the public perception is that this man knows what he is talking about - even though it's fairly obvious that he doesn't have a clue. He can say anything, just like guns are hard to get hold of in Manchester (Dale Creggan didn't have a problem getting hold of them - or hand grenades for that matter) and the public think that he is right - because they have no little or no exposure to what goes on in the criminal underworld and look to people in authority for their opinions - because they are sheep.

A publicly pro-shooting senior policeman would be committing career suicide - so even if they really thought this, they wouldn't say anything. Don't forget, officers that have an interest in shooting don't normally make it into firearms, so how is this stance likely to be viewed higher up the ladder?

Most top police officers are more politicians than anything else and like every other politician are interested in two things - themselves and power. Nothing (including truth) is likely to get in the way of that.

I haven't really commented on this debate on any of the forums I frequent, largely because it's all been said before. Farage is a fringe politician, he (like UKIP) gets a few soundbites, but has no serious political influence other than to make the Tories nervous. It seems to me that he is trying to attract as many fringe groups to his party's cause as he possibly can. Shooters are no different.

Largely thanks to the stinking media in this country, guns are such a taboo subject in the UK, that no politician or political party (and I'm really talking about the Tories here, because Labour and the Lib Dems would happily see us with no guns whatsoever if they could) is going to lighten gun laws.

When there is a period of lessening gun crime (which I don't think we've seen for some time), they'll say it's because of our gun laws. When there is a tragedy or upsurge in gun crime, you get people like ACPO saying the laws need to be tightened further, we really can't win.

Can anyone (who isn't an active supporter) name 5 other UKIP politicians? I would liken them to the Tea Party in the States, all they do is fragment the right leaning vote, to the benefit of the left.

If people really want to repeal the pistol ban - there is only one person you need to convince and that's Rupert Murdoch. Get him on side and make it part of his message through the "press" and you have a chance, because then our political puppets might think about backing the cause.

Short of him being attacked in a situation where a privately owned gun makes a difference, this isn't going to happen. Because even then, he would believe that armed protection is only a right for the ruling elite and the rest of us don't matter.

[froggy]

Re- Blackknight74,

If people really want to repeal the pistol ban - there is only one person you need to convince and that's Rupert Murdoch.
Sadly it tells a lot about British democracy but nevertheless it's a fair comment ...

Farage is a fringe politician, he (like UKIP) gets a few soundbites, but has no serious political influence other than to make the Tories nervous.


Yet an other coalition can be expected at the next elections.
Lib Dem field 43K card members, UKIP 35K and according to opinion polls, the Lib-Dem today would not even get 10% of the votes....

Now , don't forget that what you have in your safe is not enshrined in law. Far from it . It can be taken away from you as easily as semi-autos and hand-guns were in the past .
So ... as a shooter and strictly with shooting in mind, who would you rather see in power ?

a) Labour + Lib-Dem, simply put , about the worst nightmare becoming true ?
b) Tory + Lib-Dem, for an other round of what we had ... euuurh ... nothing really...
c) Tory + UKIP, with a leader that makes such a public stand in favour of shooters ?

I think it's a no-brainer

[joe]

Greater mancheater police : working for a safer government !

where is NRA et al to counter against this lies put by this so called chief officer of police and media bashing against UKIP?????


also if handgun are problem, then i take it he refuses to allow Long barrel revovlers and pistols in his force areas because of FAC Holders using them to rob banks ! muppet !

[the running man]

I guess now all the legally owed handguns are gone the police can go in and collect all the handguns from the hood where there used to settle respect issues......oh aren't the police doing that yet? Come on chop chop the ban came in years ago......