The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

ovenpaa wrote:I always though this was the case as well, once an S5 always an S5. That was until the L1A1 straight pulls with original receivers hit the market.

ITL's M1 carbines have just gone through the same process and they are now selling like hot cakes, don't forget even the first 9mm Unicorns were siezed as S5 but were modified by Bob and once re-classified as S1 released back to the owners with new lower receivers.

Blackstuff wrote:The Police are well aware of what can and can't be done with an AR for example. So if even if you bought a short barreled but long/fixed stock gun, the actual length measurement is take from the back of the recoil buffer tube, not from the heel of the stock, therefore if you also had a long barreled but folding/collapseable stocked 2nd AR and you mixed and matched, the guns OAL would still be greater than 60cm legal length

Is it legal for the police to arbitrarily decide what point of the firearm they're going to measure from? What's to stop them suddenly deciding (for example) to start measuring all LBRs from the back of the cylinder instead of the far end of the counterbalance?

The "police" don't decide - the Home Office do - and it is laid down in law!

Mike

MiLisCer wrote:The "police" don't decide - the Home Office do - and it is laid down in law!

Mike

It's laid down in law that fixed stocks are not to be taken into account when measuring a firearm? <scratches head>

Gaz wrote:

MiLisCer wrote:The "police" don't decide - the Home Office do - and it is laid down in law!

Mike

It's laid down in law that fixed stocks are not to be taken into account when measuring a firearm? <scratches head>

Typical Journalist :-P - I never said that Gaz

Gaz wrote: It's laid down in law that fixed stocks are not to be taken into account when measuring a firearm? <scratches head>

Are you sure you're not thinking about folding stocks in the fixed position, which is stated in legislation?

Sim G wrote:

Gaz wrote: It's laid down in law that fixed stocks are not to be taken into account when measuring a firearm? <scratches head>

Are you sure you're not thinking about folding stocks in the fixed position, which is stated in legislation?

Surely a fixed stock is a fixed stock, i.e. the police (or anyone else) can't just say "we feel like measuring from point X today" to determine if a firearm's legal or not...

Gaz wrote:Surely a fixed stock is a fixed stock, i.e. the police (or anyone else) can't just say "we feel like measuring from point X today" to determine if a firearm's legal or not...

Gaz, where are you getting this from? A fixed stock is a fixed stock and forms part of the overall length of the shotgun or firearm. From the toe of the stock to the muzzle. Or in the case of an LBR, from the end of the rod to the muzzle..... A fixed ie non-folding/collapsing, stock. There is absolutely nothing in legislation that says a fixed stock is to be discounted in determining the overall length of a gun. In fact, where a stock is mentioned is Section 5 (8);

"(8)For the purposes of subsection (1)(aba) and (ac) above, any detachable, folding, retractable or other movable butt-stock shall be disregarded in measuring the length of any firearm.

So, if you have a folding stock on your gun, the overall length is taken when the stock is folded, retracted or removed, not from it's extended position. If anyone tells you that a fixed stock is to be discounted, they are talking out of their ar$e....

I think by fixed stock the regs mean not removable, LBB the rod is not removable. GSG5 etc can have a fixed stock but removable so barrel & action must be over 600mm.


TW

toffe wrapper wrote:GSG5 etc can have a fixed stock but removable so barrel & action must be over 600mm.

No it doesn't. The GSG5 can have a retractable or folding stock, so the measurement must be taken with these stocks retracted or folded. The GSG5 also has a fixed stock, so the measurement will be taken with this stock in place, as with the others, as it can't be folded or retracted.

All of the GSG5 stocks, folding, retractable or fixed, are secured to the weapon by a screw, so why would they have to be removed? Likewise, my 10/22, all of my Marlins, my Savage and whatever else, have their stocks held to the action by a screw and can be removed. They don't have to be removed, so why a GSG?