The old chestnut of firearms for self defence - a question..

[Rab]

Fortunately the vast majority of illegal firearm usage in the UK, is from gangs, targeted towards gangs

The same could be said of the US. In fact I'll go as far to say that the majority of legal concealed pistol carriers are not the problem in the US.

[breacher]

@Ordnance

Why can you not see what I've already explained?

There's a huge difference between arming and training 7,200 officers, and arming and training 100,000+

And again, we aren't talking about the risk of arming Police, we're talking arming anyone who has a fancy for owning a gun for self defence.

Also, you can't just exclude a perfectly good example because you disagree with it. America has a huge problem, the causes are widespread, but the less steps we take towards that way of thinking and life, the better.



@Sim

Then I ask, don't assume that because I do what I do for a living, that I think I'm above any other human being.

We need legally owned firearms held by Armed Police to combat the illegally held firearms in the UK. Fortunately the vast majority of illegal firearm usage in the UK, is from gangs, targeted towards gangs. That is the only "monopoly" on force that should exist.

Everyone else has the right to defend themselves, within the confines of the law, just like Police Officers do.

Correct - we as civilians have a right to defend ourselves. But it is illegal for us to possess any article with which to do so. Apart from "instant arming".

Bit like allowing us to drive a car but making it an offence to sit in a car.

[ordnance]

Why can you not see what I've already explained?

There's a huge difference between arming and training 7,200 officers, and arming and training 100,000+

I get what what you are saying but the training would be no more expencie or difficult than training the police already receive.

Example.

PSNI.
The total cost of the
3 week standard driving course
is
£663.29

PSNI.
The total cost of the
2 week initial firearm course
is
£ 582.94

[martin2sheds]

This Canadian chap has his view on England’s position on the question of firearms for self-defence;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6f5_eXlhno

The “Old Offender” mentioned was also found guilty of supplying ammunition, so not just possession of a firearm

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -home.html

My apologies for a Daily Mail link, to those offended.

[Daryll]

This Canadian chap has his view on England’s position on the question of firearms for self-defence;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6f5_eXlhno

The “Old Offender” mentioned was also found guilty of supplying ammunition, so not just possession of a firearm

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -home.html

My apologies for a Daily Mail link, to those offended.

"selling or transferring ammunition to someone who was not a registered firearms dealer"... is that a crime..??

[Gazoo]

no but the standards in our newspapers is

[Sim G]

"selling or transferring ammunition to someone who was not a registered firearms dealer"... is that a crime..??

It is not the full wording of the offence that has been published.

S3(2) Firearm Act 1968 states;

"It is an offence for a person to sell or transfer to any other person in the United Kingdom, other than a registered firearms dealer, any firearm or ammunition to which section 1 of this Act applies, or a shot gun, unless that other produces a firearm certificate authorising him to purchase or acquire it or, as the case may be, his shot gun certificate, or shows that he is by virtue of this Act entitled to purchase or acquire it without holding a certificate."

[Gazoo]

As for British have always been able to defend themselves and the Winston quote, I think you are missing something crucial to both those things....Class.
Winston wasn't thinking about working class houses , he will have meant good old middle class houses and a gentleman could always walk down the road and pull a webley out to defend himself against a ruffian, the police would turn up and salute him, call him sir etc, but a bin man walking down the street who shoots a ruffian would have been locked up and hanged, no salutes or sir-ing there. Twas always thus.
Don't forget the start of all this was after the first world war, when they rushed through controls to stop the millions of pi**ed off heroes coming home to nothing different than before but having seen the russians overthrow their masters.

The class system?! Honestly.....

yes, think deeper than your holster Sim G
When the only people asking for a permit for a pistol were playing golf with the chief constable at the time or on a board of directors with an MP or minister, it was all cool, then scumbag working men (then even black people ) start asking for them and we have to rethink things.
You are worried about freedom to carry a gun for a one in a million terrorist attack. What we should all be worried about is how the people who run our lives are systematically eroding all our other freedoms, in the name of those same terrorist attacks, used to be reds under the bed.
Just for any one who is not sure about my views on CCW, I am all in favour of it for me....
It's just you lot I don't trust

[Sim G]

Gazoo, I don't think I could go deeper than your paranoia. Sorry bud...

[Gazoo]

Gazoo, I don't think I could go deeper than your paranoia. Sorry bud...

paranoia ??? I'm not the one wanting to go everywhere armed
but good luck mate, I am fairly sure you will not be able to shine in an armed citizen/ISIS shoot out event but I am positive that some machine or person from MI5/ SB will be reading this AND if they don't like what they see, you emails, mail and bank accounts too

Well that is the last word on it from me as it is tiresome, you good ole boys get on with your CCW debate.