Challenging unsafe behaviour

[Dougan]

Indeed, most actions will close without re-cocking - because they are already cocked!

I was hoping you'd give me more credit, and that I wouldn't have to go over all the 'ins and outs' - I am fully away that some rifles cock on opening (but not many I've seen used at the Trafalgar), my Swing does, but it can either be de-cocked by hand out of the rifle and put back in, or gently eased (not dry fired) with the trigger on closing...

...however I'm not arguing the point; especially with someone who has been very helpful in the past with my dumb TR questions :cheers:

[Dougan]

It's very interesting hearing the conversation between servers and civvies - For civvies a loaded mag in the rifle off the point is not allowed, and for someone to point their rifle, even with a flag in, at anyone is a big no-no...so totally different from a soldier on operations.

Someone posted a good video a while back of a soldier clearing his rifle in Afghanistan - The magazine was taken out and gun cleared by another person, then it was pointed into a purpose built hole (a tube in the ground covered in sandbags) and dry-fired, then the safety was applied and the mag put back in...I thought for the situation it was a very good system.

[Chapuis]

Similarly Dougan the police often carry ballistic bags on their ARV's so that the muzzle of their weapons can be pointed into the bag and the weapon unloaded on the roadside where they are unable to point the firearm in a safe direction to unload.

[SevenSixTwo]

For civvies a loaded mag in the rifle off the point is not allowed, and for someone to point their rifle, even with a flag in, at anyone is a big no-no...so totally different from a soldier on operations.

Sounds totally the same, to me.

Someone posted a good video a while back of a soldier clearing his rifle in Afghanistan - The magazine was taken out and gun cleared by another person, then it was pointed into a purpose built hole (a tube in the ground covered in sandbags) and dry-fired, then the safety was applied and the mag put back in...I thought for the situation it was a very good system.

Ah, the 1 metre range!

[rox]

then it was pointed into a purpose built hole (a tube in the ground covered in sandbags) and dry-fired, then the safety was applied and the mag put back in...I thought for the situation it was a very good system.

There used to be one of these at the entrance to Bisley during the Imperial; was never sure if it was for service competitors or only for MilForce guards. I think there is/was also one in Fultons for test firing.

..

[Dougan]

For civvies a loaded mag in the rifle off the point is not allowed, and for someone to point their rifle, even with a flag in, at anyone is a big no-no...so totally different from a soldier on operations.

Sounds totally the same, to me.

Excuse me if I've got this wrong...I'm just going on what I've seen on documentaries on Afghanistan and Iraq etc. - I'm sure I've seen soldiers walking around camp (even in their shorts on the way to the bog) with their rifles with them; and was assuming that the magazines in them were full...?

Also, sometimes I'm sure I've seen soldiers with their weapons slung over their shoulders, who when talking to someone else ends up passing the muzzle across other people (mainly across the legs, but sometime the body too)

Question - When soldiers are outside the camp/compound, what state are the weapons in?...Do they put one up the spout as soon as the patrol starts, or do they remain safe until contact?

[meles meles]

On camp our SOPs were that we carried our bangstick at all times, even when off duty (ie in shorts on our way to scran or the bog), magazine attached, safety on but no round chambered. That way we were ready at all times to deal with local trouble (ie renegade LEC*s) simply by chambering a round and letting rip**

As we went out the front gate we 'made ready', ie, round chambered, safety on...



* Locally Employed Contractor, ie a local permitted onto the base area, see also HRI ***
** Multiple single aimed shots until dead
*** High Risk Individual

[Dougan]

Thanks Badger sign92

[meles meles]

our pleasure, Skwirrel*


*Tree rat

[SevenSixTwo]

Excuse me if I've got this wrong...I'm just going on what I've seen on documentaries on Afghanistan and Iraq etc. - I'm sure I've seen soldiers walking around camp (even in their shorts on the way to the bog) with their rifles with them; and was assuming that the magazines in them were full...?

It's all dependent on Unit and/or Station SOPs as pointed out earlier. Certainly in the FOBs it usually is as above but when in Bastion I just left mine in my locker (along with all the ammo/grenades/morphine etc). Hideously insecure (I hated doing it) - and I did question the practice - but that's what most people did. I was last there in 2009/10 btw and I think that's all changed now, what with all the 'green on blues').