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joe wrote:

Sixshot6 wrote:

joe wrote:Yes i would agree with that

Good, I have another idea.... but its in the future and lets see it work first.

PM me with your idea plse

Ok will do.

Sixshot6 wrote:

Tony-c wrote:Single actions not much use

No, but better than nothing and gets some people interested. So right now our solutions are find a company with a good rep and get them to send not already assembled frames or get someone to build a lever release/MARS action LBP. Is that what we all agree on at this stage?

so you want to go to all the effort and cost of sa lbr development etc. Get people to buy them and then if they want to shoot several of the gr matches they have to sell them and buy something else. Kind of defeats the object in my opinion.

Tony-c wrote:

Sixshot6 wrote:

Tony-c wrote:Single actions not much use

No, but better than nothing and gets some people interested. So right now our solutions are find a company with a good rep and get them to send not already assembled frames or get someone to build a lever release/MARS action LBP. Is that what we all agree on at this stage?

so you want to go to all the effort and cost of sa lbr development etc. Get people to buy them and then if they want to shoot several of the gr matches they have to sell them and buy something else. Kind of defeats the object in my opinion.

It was just a suggestion ok. For plinkers they are ok. I mean look how many people had GSG's then sold them when Ruger BX25's came out and Smith and Wesson M&P 15-22's came out. Now you can't give away a GSG (and I've seen this up when a dealer I knew refused to even take one off a guy).

Another idea if the Lever release could be made to work or someone other system would be find an exporter in the US willing to export 80% 1911 frames.

http://www.tacticalmachining.com/tm-191 ... t-new.html

They've never been assembled and would make a great springboard to build some LBP 1911's of some description. Falling that ask Low mills about their source of Frame kits, they started partially building their 22's in house due to what the scare of 2013-14 did to barrel supplies. So the lesson there is frames can be sourced in some form and then maybe a complete gun could be build this way.

Well at least we're talking of a solution to a problem. Not talking would be worse.

Back to the title of this thread. The Europa looks like the only viable way, to get a smith and wesson based LBR. 0% credit card over 24 or 32 months and bobs yer uncle. As for a single action LBR, only being useful for plinking, i think the world record for long distance pistol scores, is held by a single action revolver.

monkeyhanger wrote:Back to the title of this thread. The Europa looks like the only viable way, to get a smith and wesson based LBR. 0% credit card over 24 or 32 months and bobs yer uncle. As for a single action LBR, only being useful for plinking, i think the world record for long distance pistol scores, is held by a single action revolver.

What cal is that record held by then? And are you saying rudefatdog operates a credit scheme?

Sixshot6 wrote: Yes and no and at least a couple of people told me 1997 they saw the Colts were not as good guns. One guy in particular, his father had one, something broke on the trigger, it was fixed and it felt it was not the same afterwards. He sold, got a Richard Wilson blueprinted and modded model 38 and loved it.

I very much doubt those berating the Python ever shot one, never mind owned one. The Python was essentially a custom gun, out of the box. There were cast parts to a Python, everything milled and were hand fitted by Colt gunsmiths. The trigger pull was outstanding. 2.5lb, glass rod single action and rolling 8lb double action. The reset was not as short as a Smith, but training discounted that. Smiths didn't like Pythons because there was nothing they could work on, except recess the chamber mouths for easier use with speed loaders.

The finish on a Python was second to none. The Royal Blue was second to none. And the earlier ones, 1955 to 1980, had a slightly tapered bore. They shot better than any production revolver on the market. Colt did try to make less expensive Pythons, but it didn't work. Hence the Trooper MkIII and then the King Cobra, sending the Python from the production line with the 'smiths responsible for it, to the Custom Shop.

The Python was not as popular as a S&W because it was nearly twice as expensive! The cylinder opening didn't mate well with fast reloads and as said, there was little a gunsmith could do it. And in relation to the operation of a Pythons cylinder latch, it was not as conducive to a speed reload as a Smith latch.

There were a lot of differences, but the Python always was a superior revolver to S&W K and L frames.

Sim G wrote:
There were a lot of differences, but the Python always was a superior revolver to S&W K and L frames.

Absolutely!

The S&Ws came and went, except for my Triple Lock, but the Python was a keeper from day one.

Sim G wrote:

Sixshot6 wrote: Yes and no and at least a couple of people told me 1997 they saw the Colts were not as good guns. One guy in particular, his father had one, something broke on the trigger, it was fixed and it felt it was not the same afterwards. He sold, got a Richard Wilson blueprinted and modded model 38 and loved it.

I very much doubt those berating the Python ever shot one, never mind owned one. The Python was essentially a custom gun, out of the box. There were cast parts to a Python, everything milled and were hand fitted by Colt gunsmiths. The trigger pull was outstanding. 2.5lb, glass rod single action and rolling 8lb double action. The reset was not as short as a Smith, but training discounted that. Smiths didn't like Pythons because there was nothing they could work on, except recess the chamber mouths for easier use with speed loaders.

The finish on a Python was second to none. The Royal Blue was second to none. And the earlier ones, 1955 to 1980, had a slightly tapered bore. They shot better than any production revolver on the market. Colt did try to make less expensive Pythons, but it didn't work. Hence the Trooper MkIII and then the King Cobra, sending the Python from the production line with the 'smiths responsible for it, to the Custom Shop.

The Python was not as popular as a S&W because it was nearly twice as expensive! The cylinder opening didn't mate well with fast reloads and as said, there was little a gunsmith could do it. And in relation to the operation of a Pythons cylinder latch, it was not as conducive to a speed reload as a Smith latch.

There were a lot of differences, but the Python always was a superior revolver to S&W K and L frames.

I get your point, but the main guy I mentioned, his father did own one (he was showing me his pre 1997 collection that he was smart enough to sell before SHFT in 1996) And a Python was there in the collection. Maybe it was later one as they seem to decline in quality after a certain year (I'm guessing 1980 is the year things turned to crap?). But at the same time there is a reason that Smith is in the healthy position its in and Colt......... Not so.

If he was smart, he wouldn't have sold. I got more money from the government for it, than I paid Bagnall & Kirkwood new...

"Crap" Pythons? No. "Lower quality Pythons" were turned out as Trooper MkIIIs, then King Cobras. Different finishes were offered, such as a matt blue that didn't require the polishing and stainless replaced high quality nickle, but all the innards were still milled and hand fitted by gunsmiths...

Colt hit hard times because they became complacent. The three most copied guns in the planet are all from the Colt catalog. And you think that S&W haven't turned out shoite? The stewardship of Tomkins Plc didn't just turn out an inferior product, they very nearly went completely belly up! I've owned and shot extensively revolvers by Colt, S&W, Ruger, Taurus, Arminus, Uberti and even an FN. The only revolver I ever regret not owning was a Colt model and like dromia, the only one that stayed till I could have it no more, was the Python.

Sim G wrote:If he was smart, he wouldn't have sold. I got more money from the government for it, than I paid Bagnall & Kirkwood new...

"Crap" Pythons? No. "Lower quality Pythons" were turned out as Trooper MkIIIs, then King Cobras. Different finishes were offered, such as a matt blue that didn't require the polishing and stainless replaced high quality nickle, but all the innards were still milled and hand fitted by gunsmiths...

Colt hit hard times because they became complacent. The three most copied guns in the planet are all from the Colt catalog. And you think that S&W haven't turned out shoite? The stewardship of Tomkins Plc didn't just turn out an inferior product, they very nearly went completely belly up! I've owned and shot extensively revolvers by Colt, S&W, Ruger, Taurus, Arminus, Uberti and even an FN. The only revolver I ever regret not owning was a Colt model and like dromia, the only one that stayed till I could have it no more, was the Python.

Ok I get you and Tomkins really were shoite. The Chairman of my club related a story of where he had a 44 mag of theirs blow up twice and once was told not to use factory ammo. You're right about what happened. It seems Smith, Ruger and other companies wised up to how the US gunowning public would only tolerate so much in the end. Colt was behind the curve by that point sadly. My dad would love to own a python when we've got to the Isle of man, but he's not willing to pony the 2K plus he'd have to pay.

I guess what it boils down to at this stage is, are you going for a Europa now Sim?