The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

A condition of using MoD Ranges is that all 'Incidents' are reported even where no persons are injured, this applies to Civilian Clubs as well as the military.

Ammunition incidents occur even with commercially and military supplied ammunition, there is a procedure to be followed after any such incident to ensure that if there are problems with a 'batch' it can be quarantined.

When an incident involves hand loaded ammunition it should be in theory easier to determine the cause and there should also be no need to inform the wider community about a 'batch' problem. However, as all incidents should be recorded the MoD will be keeping an eye on the statistics to see if there is a developing trend and they have a duty to 'learn' from experience so as to reduce the number of incidents.

If hand loaded ammunition starts to figure in those incident statistics there may well be a call from the MoD to prohibit the use of home loaded ammunition on MoD Ranges; this is where the NRA will be needed to fight our corner as they did when there was concern about civilian fired shots escaping the RDA.

It is incumbent on all hand loaders to be careful about how the manufacture their ammunition, unfortunately, some hand loaders get it wrong now and again.

They are not going to ban reloaded ammunition. However, they probably will introduce a Certification of Competency that will require you attend a course for a fat fee :shakeshout:

Have you read the actual article in the NRA in full, I think the OP has quoted the comments out of context.

The remark came in reference to the issues around NRA Rule 150 which is a technical spec for 7.62 chamber dimensions. What Andrew was basically saying we've had months of meetings and arguments between experts on the safety or not of current rule 150 but there have been no incidents compared to incidents caused by hand loads.

I did read the full article, and I still found the comment overly negative.

Mr_Logic wrote:I did read the full article, and I still found the comment overly negative.

Also.

channel12 wrote:Have you read the actual article in the NRA in full, I think the OP has quoted the comments out of context.

The remark came in reference to the issues around NRA Rule 150 which is a technical spec for 7.62 chamber dimensions. What Andrew was basically saying we've had months of meetings and arguments between experts on the safety or not of current rule 150 but there have been no incidents compared to incidents caused by hand loads.

Yes, he's just telling it as it is...

...his final comments were a nod to the regions too, acknowledging that it's not all about Bisley...but I notice that no one has commented on that...

The regions have known about that for years we don't need any body to tell us we already know we have been shouting it from the roof tops for ever. We are still waiting for some one to do some thing about it.

It positive actions the regions need not words, we've had plenty of them from the NRA over the years.

Cj10 wrote:I have personally spoken to Mercer about handloading, so I understand the ilandscape he is operating within.

How many issues have arisen on MOD ranges with civilian hand loaded ammunition in recent times? Not that many, but enough for the MOD to question the level of risk which arises by permitting cilvilian clubs to use handloaded ammunition on MOD ranges.

Ceri

Funny, I remember quite a few during my illustrious career with military ammo.

Several involving rogue missiles.

Like I said, so far the ONLY civilian ammunition failures I have had were with factory ammo purchased from the NRA.

Given their legendary organisational and training standards......Just assuming this potential nightmare became reality, it would be interesting to consider the loss or revenue to the NRA during the period they were putting each and every hand loader that might use any range covered by any certification requirement, through their own "Special" brand of training.

Not to mention those who would see it as "time to go".

After having to stop one of an RCOs course who was shooting next to me a few weeks back (merilly putting round after round of .308 a just under the top edge of centuries butstop), I dont hold out much hope.

Good job someone was watching for fall of shot, it was nearly, very nearly, over and away.....nothing like practicing what you preach and checking zero eh

Nothing we do is 100% risk free, surely they should be stressing this and protecting the status quo.

As others have already mentioned a ban on hand loading would be the death knell for shooting in the UK. One would hope that Andrew Mercer is actually aware of that and not just paying lip service. Would I give up shooting if hand loading were banned? Probably. Not so much because of the expense of shooting factory - I have an AI .338LM and would certainly not be paying nearly £400 per 100! - but mostly because I enjoy hand loading. Fundamentally shooting and hand loading facilitate each other in equal measure, so banning one would inevitably affect the other.

What are the effective options:

A. Submitting say 10 hand loaded rounds for inspection by the Proof House and being certified to reload that calibre -simple solution, but no guarantee that consistency would follow for future batches. Time, cost and resources would be an issue.

B. Require hand loaders to attend a certified course - simple solution, but still no guarantee that consistency would follow for future batches. Time, cost and resources would be an issue.

C. Do nothing other than publicise good practice and monitor the situation - simplest solution, but still no guarantee that consistency or quality would improve for those hand loaders that throw rounds together just to save money and get a bang.

Like so many I have been reloading for decades and buy the best equipment available and strive to learn everything I can about techniques and procedures and have a self imposed QC procedure, so I know anything I reload is safe. Short of banning reloading altogether, no matter what procedures are imposed, there will always be those that cut corners and should not be trusted with a pair of scissors, let alone a potential pipe bomb.

This is why we have become a nanny state; because there is no legislation other than restriction that addresses stupidity. Again there is the possibility that a very small minority will impact on the majority and we should all hope that the NRA, our governing body, will have the wit to circumvent opposing views, although I am not sure that an erstwhile theme park manager is the man to head that up.