Handgun approval, different mentality to the UK.

[Christel]

I suddenly realise (gosh I must be getting old forgetting that) that we have had a similar discussion on here about this very subject. To be allowed to carry or not.

Despite (it seems) being in the minority here I stick to my guns ( ha ha )

Question is, am I really THE ONLY one who believes it is a bad idea to carry?
I know this is a shooting forum but that does not mean everybody thinks the same about different subjects.

Anyone...not the ones who are for carrying, especially Chuck!

[Sim G]

NM
http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/nm/crime/

Albuquerque
http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/nm/albuquerque/crime/

We have been projected here in the US for 2011 as SECOND highest crime rate in the nation just after Nevada.
Patrick

So we're talking 744 violent crimes per 100000 residents, whilst the US average is 470. That may seem that NM has a crime rate, however, I'd imagine that the average UK resident would cope with NM rate as the UK records 2034 violent crimes per 100000!!!! The higest in Europe and even 400 per 100K higher than South Africa!

[Sim G]

I suddenly realise (gosh I must be getting old forgetting that) that we have had a similar discussion on here about this very subject. To be allowed to carry or not.

Despite (it seems) being in the minority here I stick to my guns ( ha ha )

Question is, am I really THE ONLY one who believes it is a bad idea to carry?
I know this is a shooting forum but that does not mean everybody thinks the same about different subjects.

Anyone...not the ones who are for carrying, especially Chuck!

There was a study I read a few years ago that attempted to gain a demographic of the "gun owner". This was conducted in the US, of course, but was regarded as "too general" for serious acedemic use. It was rubbished perhaps not because it was not specific enough, but the result didn't fall within the parameters that the study sponsor was looking for, namely that gun owners were white, middle class professional, suburb residing, and anti welfare/social care.

Turns out that the results of the study showed no ethnic lines and that the majority of gun owners we're employees at working/lower middle class level, who were self reliant and politically aware. Generally right wing or right of center, with strong patriotic and community ideals.

Strangely enough, it looks that the study was not far off the mark. And given the demographics of this board, perhaps national borders don't effect the "ideals" of those that are attracted to shooting/guns.......

There mightn't be many who answer your call for support........

[Christel]

Bloody hell Sim G,

Scary numbers!

:shock:

[Chuck]

Christel, you believe it is a bad idea to carry, try asking the victims..What I am saying is we should have the CHOICE, something victims normally do not have.


As for who gets the, how many chav types, lowlifes etc etc as mentioned earlier do you see on the range on in your club?? After all they have the right NOW to acquire firearms. so where is the logic in that argument. What seems to be the argument is that law abiding cannot have because criminals MIGHT get them, err it is a bit late for that.

[Blackstuff]

I'm all for a proper 'right' to self-defence using firearms and for concealed carry (not open), however i think the process should be laborious (6mths-1yr) and 'expensive' (£200-£500) to keep the scum away. This may sound elitest but its a stone cold fact that the poorer you are the more likely you and your offspring will be involved in physical crime.

Exactly what the laborious process would be i'm not sure but it would definitely involve safe handling/use training and examination, months of drilling and classroom sessions on the lawful use of firearms for defence.

[Sim G]

its a stone cold fact that the poorer you are the more likely you and your offspring will be involved in physical crime.

Mark,

That's not a stone cold fact, it's just plain wrong!

Just because a lot of criminals are "poor", that does not mean the a lot of the poor are criminals! What is a fact, is that being poor makes you more likely to be victimised, generally due to the areas you have to reside in! And trust me, I've met criminals who have more money than I will ever see, save for coming up with six numbers on the lottery!

If, CCW returned to the UK, by making it out of reach of the poor you would be deying those that need it more and those would have the greatest impact on the "criminal class" with any defensive gun use.

There is a gun company in the US called Lorcin. They make the cheapest full sized, defensive pistol on the market. It's down right ugly, but it works. Lorcin has been in business for a long time and sells more guns that some of the "top end" manufacturers. Why? Because they provide a product that makes armed defence accessible to all. If you want to make CCW elite, then lets just keep it with the polticians being allowed proper protection.....

[pe4king]

As I see it surely the current (vetting) system would be built upon, which would not allow just anybody to walk into a shop and buy a self defence weapon therefore your scumbag would still only have access to the type of weapons he has now isnt that how it works in the states ?.

[Alpha1]

This argument comes up all the time on gun boards.
I live in the UK was originally a pistol shooter until they banned them I own about 14 rifles shoot regulary.
No way would I want any body in the UK to be allowed to carry a hand gun concealed or not including my self.
What I would like is for any body involved in killing some one with a gun put to death as well as the guy who sold them the gun in the first place.
The laws in the UK are far to soft to allow people to be armed shoot some one you will get ten year in jail if your lucky.Chances are even less.
No thank you.

[Chuck]

Exactly what the laborious process would be i'm not sure but it would definitely involve safe handling/use training and examination, months of drilling and classroom sessions on the lawful use of firearms for defence.

Alpha1, again, why force YOUR fears on those trhat need protection. Your argument falls apart very quickly, why execute the DEALER FFS, that's just daft., Jeezuz, just imagine if YOU sold a gun to your best mate and he went OTT.. then YOU get it for selling the gun. Why do you deny people the right to defend themselves in an attack. What is the use of executing someone when you could have stopped the attack, you supposing it only happens to others then.

Suppose it was you and YOUR missus on the receiving end Alpha1, still happy to watch and be a good witness whilst she gets gangraped and beaten... that's pervy. And what if YOU end up the same way, how does THAT solve anything, is it better for you to be dead than a scumbag?????

If anyone does not value their life or that of a loved one that much they should have a life rethink. No offence to anyone such minded.