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ukrifleman wrote:Never had a problem breaking clays since the 80's with my Baikal o/u !

Heard that a lot never seen it in all the competitions I’ve run!

42DAF wrote:

ukrifleman wrote:Never had a problem breaking clays since the 80's with my Baikal o/u !

Heard that a lot never seen it in all the competitions I’ve run!

in my case, I miss as many with my Baikal as I do with my Bettinsoli

ukrifleman wrote:Never had a problem breaking clays since the 80's with my Baikal o/u !

I second that!

In the late 70s when I first started on clays there were quite a few Baikals being contested at B level at the local competitions and when coupled with Baikal cartridges I witnessed not only spectacular pyrotechnics, I also saw some very good scores in sporting. Looking back at it I cannot remember many 'expensive' shotguns although I did shoot a neighbours Browning from time to time as he was the same build as myself, plus he dared not shoot it for fear of damaging given that it had cost more than his Triumph Stag!

EDIT - the slip it was in probably cost more than the car I ran at the time.

I've seen very few since being involved with clay shooting (not 70s I wasn't born) doing even averagely well, this is due in main part to poor stock dimensions with overly low combs and short stocks. There are much more suitable guns available at very sensible money like mk38 or even 3800s mk70, Beretta 686/682s browning 3/4/525 that have actually won Home and World Titles and will cost £600-1000 ish depending on embellishment and time of year.

42DAF wrote:I've seen very few since being involved with clay shooting (not 70s I wasn't born) doing even averagely well, this is due in main part to poor stock dimensions with overly low combs and short stocks. There are much more suitable guns available at very sensible money like mk38 or even 3800s mk70, Beretta 686/682s browning 3/4/525 that have actually won Home and World Titles and will cost £600-1000 ish depending on embellishment and time of year.

makes my £80 baikal look cheap it's still my go to truck gun though

kennyc wrote:

42DAF wrote:

ukrifleman wrote:Never had a problem breaking clays since the 80's with my Baikal o/u !

Heard that a lot never seen it in all the competitions I’ve run!

in my case, I miss as many with my Baikal as I do with my Bettinsoli

I wonder how many Baikals are at WMSG this week. They are fine as a truck or rough gun (my uncle uses one on the farm as effective as a blank firer but that’s mostly him) but as a clay gun not really.

It’s like using a CZ or savage for TR of course the bullet will hit the v bull if you put it in the right place but you’d fair better with a swing etc.

42DAF wrote:
I wonder how many Baikals are at WMSG this week. They are fine as a truck or rough gun (my uncle uses one on the farm as effective as a blank firer but that’s mostly him) but as a clay gun not really.

It’s like using a CZ or savage for TR of course the bullet will hit the v bull if you put it in the right place but you’d fair better with a swing etc.

you may be confusing lack of "coolness" with lack of capability, clay pidgeon shooting has a lot in common with golf IMHO, kit and looks are almost more important than effectiveness, no one wants to be seen with the wrong gun give a good shot a cheap gun and his score will undoubtedly drop, but he will still be better than the bulk of folk with their Gucci guns
as a poor clay shot (I go for the fun of it not to compete) I have scored regularly as high with an £80 Baikal as I have with my "nicer" Bettinsoli (itself a good £800-1000 under the price of a "decent gun" ) I have used more expensive guns (in the £8=10K range) and can appreciate the engineering and craftmanship that went into building them, but the limiting factor in my score was me not the gun, adding a good few grand to purchase price may be good for the ego and social standing, but it really didn't help the score.
now, if someone wants to get seriously into clay shooting, then a more expensive purchase may well make sense, as a serious clay gun is going to have to take the abuse of thousands of carts a year and will require rebuilding from time to time, you also undoubtedly get benefits from a more dedicated design, but the cheapo guns still have a place for the occassional shot or someone on a budget just starting out.

kennyc wrote:

42DAF wrote:
I wonder how many Baikals are at WMSG this week. They are fine as a truck or rough gun (my uncle uses one on the farm as effective as a blank firer but that’s mostly him) but as a clay gun not really.

It’s like using a CZ or savage for TR of course the bullet will hit the v bull if you put it in the right place but you’d fair better with a swing etc.

you may be confusing lack of "coolness" with lack of capability, clay pidgeon shooting has a lot in common with golf IMHO, kit and looks are almost more important than effectiveness, no one wants to be seen with the wrong gun give a good shot a cheap gun and his score will undoubtedly drop, but he will still be better than the bulk of folk with their Gucci guns
as a poor clay shot (I go for the fun of it not to compete) I have scored regularly as high with an £80 Baikal as I have with my "nicer" Bettinsoli (itself a good £800-1000 under the price of a "decent gun" ) I have used more expensive guns (in the £8=10K range) and can appreciate the engineering and craftmanship that went into building them, but the limiting factor in my score was me not the gun, adding a good few grand to purchase price may be good for the ego and social standing, but it really didn't help the score.
now, if someone wants to get seriously into clay shooting, then a more expensive purchase may well make sense, as a serious clay gun is going to have to take the abuse of thousands of carts a year and will require rebuilding from time to time, you also undoubtedly get benefits from a more dedicated design, but the cheapo guns still have a place for the occassional shot or someone on a budget just starting out.

I bow to your great experience as a retired professional shotgun instructor and senior instructor at one the largest and best shooting schools in the country, good luck with your Baikals I will continue to advise clients and anyone else who asks my advice against them, handling and balance aren't fashion they make real world difference.

42DAF wrote:

kennyc wrote:

42DAF wrote:
I wonder how many Baikals are at WMSG this week. They are fine as a truck or rough gun (my uncle uses one on the farm as effective as a blank firer but that’s mostly him) but as a clay gun not really.

It’s like using a CZ or savage for TR of course the bullet will hit the v bull if you put it in the right place but you’d fair better with a swing etc.

you may be confusing lack of "coolness" with lack of capability, clay pidgeon shooting has a lot in common with golf IMHO, kit and looks are almost more important than effectiveness, no one wants to be seen with the wrong gun give a good shot a cheap gun and his score will undoubtedly drop, but he will still be better than the bulk of folk with their Gucci guns
as a poor clay shot (I go for the fun of it not to compete) I have scored regularly as high with an £80 Baikal as I have with my "nicer" Bettinsoli (itself a good £800-1000 under the price of a "decent gun" ) I have used more expensive guns (in the £8=10K range) and can appreciate the engineering and craftmanship that went into building them, but the limiting factor in my score was me not the gun, adding a good few grand to purchase price may be good for the ego and social standing, but it really didn't help the score.
now, if someone wants to get seriously into clay shooting, then a more expensive purchase may well make sense, as a serious clay gun is going to have to take the abuse of thousands of carts a year and will require rebuilding from time to time, you also undoubtedly get benefits from a more dedicated design, but the cheapo guns still have a place for the occassional shot or someone on a budget just starting out.

I bow to your great experience as a retired professional shotgun instructor and senior instructor at one the largest and best shooting schools in the country, good luck with your Baikals I will continue to advise clients and anyone else who asks my advice against them, handling and balance aren't fashion they make real world difference.