The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

rox wrote:

DL. wrote:And yet people who know normally say Lapua 168 grain are only good to 600m in 308win.

Are you sure you aren't thinking of the Sierra #2200 168? That is the bullet designed for 300m shooting that regularly has problems when used inappropriately at longer distances; I've never heard of problems with a Lapua 168 - in fact, I'm not even aware that there *is* a Lapua 168 .30 cal, the closest is a 167.

..

Thanks.

I REALLY don't understand this type of bravado and its found in all types of shooting not just long distance (and every group of people in life in general I suppose). And i'm sorry to say that i've found it proportionately increases the further south you go. Call me a cloth-capped northern-monkey if you like but bragging BS merchants seem to get more and more common the closer to the capital you get in my experience

At a mini-rifle competition a couple of years ago as me and a few friends were prepping our gear on the range we were talking about the Southern Gun Co lever-release rifle and how I could never get the hand co-ordination right to shoot it quickly under the pressure of a timer in competition. Another friend remarked that he'd only ever seen two people who could do it quickly and reliably, to which I agreed. Cue Billy Big B*llocks standing next to us saying that he was an 'expert' with one, could get it up to nearly semi-auto speed and never pressed the lever too quickly (which causes the hammer to ride the bolt and kill the action - this was my problem with it).

Unfortunately for him, he'd brought said rifle with him for the comp and he was in our squad... Needless to say his walk did not accurately represent his talk. After watching his first run that could've been timed with a sun dial (and the remainder of the comp was at a similar speed) we didn't say anything to him, just exchanged knowing glances between ourselves, rolled our eyes and got on with the day. Whether he just had a very different idea of what running the gun quickly was, was just completely deluded or was trying to boost his confidence by over estimating his ability i'll never know, but its a practice I actively don't engage in, I've always preferred to keep my mouth shut/talk muyself down when it comes to performance and (hopefully) let my actions speak for themselves.

I've had a fair few other similar vain experiences, but I remember a few years ago on Pigeon Watch someone seriously claiming they'd head shot a rabbit at 700+ yards with a .17HMR (it may have been 704 yards IIRC!)

North or south of the M4 , we've all had the odd brilliant day when we can't miss that centre ring, and the crack shots have the odd crappy day when they can't hit jack sh*t...............

C'est la vie...........

Pete

We get the same thing time and time again at the small-bore club... Usually people who shoot game are the people with the "smallest groups" - but they never seem to be able to shoot the middle of a barn door when they're behind a rifle at the club....

Everyone will always claim that they can shoot their smallest group in their life, but it's all about consistency. You might have the group of a century, or put 3 bullets into a clover leaf - but if the rest of the day you're peppering a piece of paper the size of A4, then you can't shoot sub .5 MOA.

One group does not make a precise shooter. Being able to shoot consistently is key. I'll always show my competition scores, as they can't be refuted, for the most part. If someone tells me an anecdote that they can shoot XYZ - I'll nod, smile and carry on...

Blackstuff wrote: Unfortunately for him, he'd brought said rifle with him for the comp and he was in our squad... Needless to say his walk did not accurately represent his talk. After watching his first run that could've been timed with a sun dial (and the remainder of the comp was at a similar speed) we didn't say anything to him, just exchanged knowing glances between ourselves, rolled our eyes and got on with the day. Whether he just had a very different idea of what running the gun quickly was, was just completely deluded or was trying to boost his confidence by over estimating his ability i'll never know, but its a practice I actively don't engage in, I've always preferred to keep my mouth shut/talk muyself down when it comes to performance and (hopefully) let my actions speak for themselves.

I've met people like this myself. Unfortunately, especially people new to competitions tend to overestimate their ability, because they've shot "fast" without a timer, people don't really have a clue what speed is until they get into competition. Then when the pressure is on people find they haven't practised their fundamentals nearly enough to be able to do them whilst under stress...

Surely the easiest way to find out is to either go with him next time he's off to the range, all friendly like, and see.
Or use his recipe in a rifle of your own and see how you do. If very well to really well then he's credible. A rifle doesn't have to be really expensive to be accurate with decently put together ammunition. The tales of WWII are replete with exceptional shots taken with the best rifles out of a batch of ordinary service rifles - why should that not carry over to ordinary civilian rifles?

And if it's BS ... well ... what's the harm unless he's trying to sell you his rifle?

Blackstuff wrote:I've had a fair few other similar vain experiences, but I remember a few years ago on Pigeon Watch someone seriously claiming they'd head shot a rabbit at 700+ yards with a .17HMR (it may have been 704 yards IIRC!)

Pah, I do that all the time with my Ruger 10/22.

Blackstuff wrote:I REALLY don't understand this type of bravado and its found in all types of shooting not just long distance (and every group of people in life in general I suppose). And i'm sorry to say that i've found it proportionately increases the further south you go. Call me a cloth-capped northern-monkey if you like but bragging BS merchants seem to get more and more common the closer to the capital you get in my experience

S'funny because I've noticed that in reverse. I once lived next door to a Yorkshireman and his brother who would hold forth on pretty much every subject, no matter how trivial, and they would always be right / come out as best.

It got to the point that I had to check the back garden before I'd venture out for fear of one of them leaning over the fence and holding me hostage to one of their tales or frowning reproach about how I ought to do stuff.

What a pair of saddos - constantly trying to impress a fourteen year old. I dunno - maybe they were grooming me for a flat cap.

TattooedGun wrote:I've met people like this myself. Unfortunately, especially people new to competitions tend to overestimate their ability, because they've shot "fast" without a timer, people don't really have a clue what speed is until they get into competition. Then when the pressure is on people find they haven't practised their fundamentals nearly enough to be able to do them whilst under stress...

The guy in the example I gave was actually quite experienced which added to the value of it all. I've only had one experience with a newbie really giving it the big 'un.

Brand new, unfired 'tactical' version of a Benelli M2 in hand (with ghost ring sights, ported barrel and fixed magazine tube - all the ingredients for a sub-par PSG gun for Standard division), brand new, crease-ironed current issue camo top and trousers and cap with 'Death From Above' moral patch on the brow....

As per usual anyone new gets put at the bottom of the squad list so they can see how to shoot a course, get familiar with the range commands etc, but without fail as each person in front of him finished their run and then came back to put their gun away, he was giving them tips on what they "should've" done, and each gem of advice clearly based on Call of Duty or a Chuck Norris film. By the time we'd shot all the stages there were people with shorter overall times than his best single stage, his 'uniform' was covered in mud and he''d somehow broken an M2. He didn't come a second time thankfully and i've never seen him since.

Dark Skies wrote:

Blackstuff wrote:I REALLY don't understand this type of bravado and its found in all types of shooting not just long distance (and every group of people in life in general I suppose). And i'm sorry to say that i've found it proportionately increases the further south you go. Call me a cloth-capped northern-monkey if you like but bragging BS merchants seem to get more and more common the closer to the capital you get in my experience

S'funny because I've noticed that in reverse. I once lived next door to a Yorkshireman and his brother who would hold forth on pretty much every subject, no matter how trivial, and they would always be right / come out as best.

It got to the point that I had to check the back garden before I'd venture out for fear of one of them leaning over the fence and holding me hostage to one of their tales or frowning reproach about how I ought to do stuff.

What a pair of saddos - constantly trying to impress a fourteen year old. I dunno - maybe they were grooming me for a flat cap.

Ah now you see a Yorkshireman/Yerksh'men is an exception to the rule. I call it 'The Clarkson Effect'.

Such things never bother me as I don't give flying feck how anybody else shoots, or claims to shoot.