.357 advice

[ovenpaa]

Longer COAL (Overall Length) will reduce pressure slightly and shorter COAL will increase pressure.

Have you got that the right way around, ovenpaa???

I should have added the proviso, as long as it is jammed solid into the lands! Yes shorter COAL = higher pressure for the same charge.

[Dougan]

Wow, didn't expect so many replies in 24 hrs....Thank you all :!:

First a reply to Covert Opps: Thanks for your advice on a load with N320..sounds a good place to start. About the 'squib loads' - I've been shooting .308 TR for about 25 years...so get my 'big bang fix' from that . However I'm relativly new to GR - I have been trying to find an accurate load with the minimum kick for shooting courses of fire like T&P 1, where you get 3 secs for 2 shots...so wanted minimum kick to get 'back on' for the second shot. It seems though from the advice I'm getting that I'm loading too low, so will have to sort that out, and then work on my GR shooting technique :roll:

More info/questions for all:

To clarify - I'm using hard cast lead bullets (the cheap ones - £25/30 per 500) - what are peoples' preferences between TC and RNFP?

Part of the problem I'm having is that the exact info I want isn't in the Vihtavuori (would like to stick to this powder as it seems good quality and is locally available) data. Firstly - the bullet types - I'm basing my loads on the 'LSWC/HP' info (not sure what FNCM means?)...is this compatible with TC and RNFP? Secondly - there is only data for N320 in .38 special cases, and I would like to stick with .357, as my rifle is chambered for it, and I have 500 cases. I did start with N320 (with no problems) but was concerned about the amount of 'free space' in the case; so switched to N340 as it filled the case up more, and there is data for it with .357 cases.

On the back of the advice I've had so far, I will go back to CCI primers; which will hopefully allow me to put more powder in the case. Also, will not go below the 'starting load'. So, using .357 cases, cci primers and either TC or RNFP, what sort of loads (with VIT 340, 320 or any other readily available powder) do you guys (and gals) suggest?

One more question: I have allways crimped into the 'canalure' (is that the right term/spelling for the crimping line?) - I am assuming that is the right thing to do? Do you have any info/opinions about crimping on this type of round...light, heavy etc.?

Sorry for so many long, rambling questions - I know there's a lot of literature on this stuff, but I'd like to know the thoughts of those who are actually doing it.

Thanks again,

John.

[Mike357]

I always use RNFP, the Winchester is funny that way. On fast courses of fire, I think the problem is racking the action and not recoil. Perfect your action.

[Dougan]

Hi Mike,

I sure you're right - I need to practice more. GR is very different from TR - I've even started using scopes (GR only), which I've always previously considered to be 'the devils work' :!: ...but it has improved my scores...

Cheers,

John

Bye the way...do you realise that you're giving good advice to an Englishman :P

[Mike357]

Hi Mike,

I sure you're right - I need to practice more. GR is very different from TR - I've even started using scopes (GR only), which I've always previously considered to be 'the devils work' :!: ...but it has improved my scores...

Cheers,

John

Bye the way...do you realise that you're giving good advice to an Englishman :P

Only becomes a problem if we both make our national teams and meet in competition :lol:

[Sim G]

Firstly, load development for pistol cartridges is usually done in test barrels of between 6 and 12 inches, so going to a faster powder for a four inch loss on a rifle is neither here nor there.

But that said, I reckon you are using the wrong powder for what you are trying to achieve. N340 is towards the slower end of powder burn chart and not far off "big boomer" magnum powders. Slow powders give erratic results when used in small quantities. The charge you are using and did use, according to several data I've looked at, is actually below 38 special starting loads, never mind 357 starting loads. However, there is no problem with using special data in magnum cases, I've been doing it for years with 357 and 44.

On top of which, I can't find any data that states v340 is suitable for lead bullets. Loads of data with jacketed, but nothing for lead. Even though everyone knows that powder has different burn rates, what is often forgot is that they can burn at different temperatures. v340 may burn too hot for lead bullets and the muzzle flash could be burning lube at the base of the bullet. Have you got more leading?

Detonation? Doubt it. Likewise, "free space" in the case. Powder towers in .38 and 357 can go really low and in some loads be nothing more that a couple or three grains of powder. Unlike rifle cartridges, the primer flame will fill the case so amount and position is relatively unimportant with regards to detonation as opposed to burning.

Also, TC or RNFP? I'd say either. I used to use TC's in pistols, but only because they fed as well as RN but gave a more defined hole to score. As for crimping, yep use the cannular but make sure they are not only long enough, but not too short. Marlins can be problematic over COL. Crimp using a fairly heavy roll crimp, into the cannular, a smidgen below the max COL of .357, 1.590 inches.

Personally, I have never had any joy using Viht in pistol calibers. Love n140 in my .223 though!

I'd say use either of your chosen bullets and look to 38 spl or spl +P for your load data in a faster powder, above the starting load, loaded just below max COL, with a firm roll crimp. The slicking of actions may involve reducing the main spring power, a favourite with match revolvers. Federal primers were always the choice for guns with "trigger jobs".

[dazeroo]

None of the advice in Sim's reply is of any help to me, but is a great example of the type of helpful and well meaning advice available here.

[dodgyrog]

Wow, didn't expect so many replies in 24 hrs....Thank you all :!:

First a reply to Covert Opps: Thanks for your advice on a load with N320..sounds a good place to start. About the 'squib loads' - I've been shooting .308 TR for about 25 years...so get my 'big bang fix' from that . However I'm relativly new to GR - I have been trying to find an accurate load with the minimum kick for shooting courses of fire like T&P 1, where you get 3 secs for 2 shots...so wanted minimum kick to get 'back on' for the second shot. It seems though from the advice I'm getting that I'm loading too low, so will have to sort that out, and then work on my GR shooting technique :roll:

More info/questions for all:

To clarify - I'm using hard cast lead bullets (the cheap ones - £25/30 per 500) - what are peoples' preferences between TC and RNFP?

Part of the problem I'm having is that the exact info I want isn't in the Vihtavuori (would like to stick to this powder as it seems good quality and is locally available) data. Firstly - the bullet types - I'm basing my loads on the 'LSWC/HP' info (not sure what FNCM means?)...is this compatible with TC and RNFP? Secondly - there is only data for N320 in .38 special cases, and I would like to stick with .357, as my rifle is chambered for it, and I have 500 cases. I did start with N320 (with no problems) but was concerned about the amount of 'free space' in the case; so switched to N340 as it filled the case up more, and there is data for it with .357 cases.

On the back of the advice I've had so far, I will go back to CCI primers; which will hopefully allow me to put more powder in the case. Also, will not go below the 'starting load'. So, using .357 cases, cci primers and either TC or RNFP, what sort of loads (with VIT 340, 320 or any other readily available powder) do you guys (and gals) suggest?

One more question: I have allways crimped into the 'canalure' (is that the right term/spelling for the crimping line?) - I am assuming that is the right thing to do? Do you have any info/opinions about crimping on this type of round...light, heavy etc.?

Sorry for so many long, rambling questions - I know there's a lot of literature on this stuff, but I'd like to know the thoughts of those who are actually doing it.

Thanks again,

John.

£25 for 500 - I'll beat that!
As for reduced recoil, when I shot the 1500 comp with my revolver I used a 105gr Lee boolit with 2.2 gr of fast burning powder (whatever was to be had cheap). These loads were for 10m stages only.
The message is with Newton and his 3rd law, ie reduce the weight/velocity of the projectile and the recoil diminishes. I even tried a 90gr RN boolit but it didn't cut a decent hole in the target. I do remember carrying a pair of pliers to remove boolits from the target backing!!!
Ref crimping - I use a taper crimp - very lightly.
If you want to chat about it send a pm and I'll give you my phone number.

[Dougan]

Again, thanks for all the comments and advice.

There's plenty of info to go at - certainly I will change to a faster powder (staying above starting loads); and then experiment with bullets and primers. Ironically I'll probably end up not far off from the load I started with a few years ago..... before I started 'trying things' :roll:

I'll get back to you in a few months, and let you know how it goes. After I've sorted out a safe and accurate GR load, I fancy trying loading for my SMLE (factory is getting expensive) - So will be back for more advice. I can't offer any help on reloading, but if anyone wants to discuss TR (must check other areas of this forum) - positioning, windage etc....I'd be happy to help.

Cheers,
John.


Mike: I doubt I'll be making any national teams, but if you're ever down this way for the Phoenix or Trafalgar meetings, I'll happily buy you a pint/tea in exchange for some advice on GR technique.

[Robin128]

Chrono and Sierra reloading manual was best investment in my reloading, along with Bonanza (now Forster) press and RCBS carbide dies...