The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

Robert, thank you for your observations, will you be raising this subject in your official capacity of Vice-President, NRA of Great Britain whilst attending the Imperial.

Chapuis, I am not sure about 90% of the trade, our takings for the last Imperial were very modest. For us the attendance was more about putting faces to names and meeting new people.

Great, one of the few specialist TR dealers has been driven out of the biggest TR meeting of the year. Slow clap for the NRA.

And when they, the NRA, have finished putting up the rents on the clubhouses by 800% all your affiliation fees will follow suit......followed, no doubt, by whopping increases in target hire.....

targetman wrote:And when they, the NRA, have finished putting up the rents on the clubhouses by 800% all your affiliation fees will follow suit......followed, no doubt, by whopping increases in target hire.....

Sad to think that a discipline that was once damned near compulsory is being driven by greed and ineptitude to a point where in some cases the best simply cannot afford to do it. Aside of this issue, some have not been backward in taking advantage of the scarcity of components and capitalised as the shooters costs.

If (and only if) that did happen I am afraid that I would have to review my shooting. I am sure I could afford it, but its not the be all and end all above my wife and home.

Chapuis wrote:Perhaps I am of the wrong mindset, that's probably why I will never make my fortune, but surely the attendance of the maximum number of gunsmiths/ dealers especially those that provide a good service to shooters should be encouraged. Even if it means that trade stands only cover the costs and don't generate substantial income for an event. After all the Imperial or the Phoenix would be less of an attraction to shooters without the trade shows.
I suppose getting the balance right is the challenge, especially when you have long established firms already on site 365 days a year and who are paying hefty rents. They must get a little resentful of interlopers taking 90% of the trade on just a few days of the year.
Setting a fair rent for all must be an absolute nightmare.

No right mindset C. BUt dont forget those that are there 365 get the majority of coverage and may not be specialists. Its the NSC after all, so all shooting related stalls should be equally welcome.

Dont worry, then thats there full time make enough or they would not be there.

Its the only opportunity many get to waffle, buy and pickup gear they have ordered. Many people dont shoot but come along for the trade stands. Traders know they wont retire on the proceeds, but they may well pick up trade they can cater for after the event having asked the questions and had a play.

It kind of makes up for the lack of decent gun shops.

As a cartridge collector its a great place to scrounge/bum/otherwise prostitute myself for the odd metalic gain

Personally I think a change is long overdue, but for the better not for the worse.

ovenpaa wrote:Chapuis, I am not sure about 90% of the trade, our takings for the last Imperial were very modest. For us the attendance was more about putting faces to names and meeting new people.

Ovenpaa perhaps its the way that I put it. I was suggesting that the likes of Fulton's may get a slight increase in trade at these meetings but that the vast majority of the trade (combined) probably goes to all the other traders who are only on site for the duration of the meeting. I'm also not suggesting than anyone actually makes a great deal at the events in fact many will probably struggle to cover their costs, and to do that they sleep on their stalls or in their vans.

How I wish that the pistol meetings had never stopped. The phoenix is only a mere shadow of the pistol meetings of the late 70s and 80s.

I struggle with the new NRA plan of increasing costs beyond the dreams of increases. I take their point about having to make things pay, but by increasing prices like that, nobody will actually shoot, at which point they will go horrendously bust. Someone needs to tell the NRA that we are already at the point where people can't afford to shoot.

I for one have just bought enough ammo for a little while and it's waaaay beyond what I can actually afford right now. Add in target costs, fuel costs, marker fees, club costs - it's nuts. So if they whack the prices up any more, I'll have to stop shooting - I don't see shooting once a year - what's the point?!

ovenpaa wrote:Robert, thank you for your observations, will you be raising this subject in your official capacity of Vice-President, NRA of Great Britain whilst attending the Imperial.

David,

No,I think I will not, as it is vain to address those who does not want to listen…

Last year I intervened for the first time ever against the decision to forbid access to Century firing points to disabled people cars, and the same UKASE appeared again for this year in the last NRA Email info received 2 days ago….

I wonder what is the cost of hiring a fleet of buggies, plus drivers wages for the period?

I used once the buggies service last year, and can say it is totally inadequate, and even dangerous and discriminatory for the disabled:

-You have to arrive well in advance to your detail schedule and wait to make sure to be on tine for your detail.
-Big probem to load and carry your equipment on the buggy. Wonder how it is for a rifle with bipods.?
-You have to carry an extra seat for the long waiting periods before and after the shoot, when you have to wait for a buggy to come by. Disabled people have standing painful difficulties.
-The buggy leave you at your range plot, then it is for the mobility impaired to move for ammunition and target…..Be sure to not be on the wrong number range!!!!...
-Being carried seated on ‘peach cores’ stuffed seats and in an unstable position on a vehicle with no suspension and small diameter wheels is a painful and potentially dangerous ride.

All this constitutes discrimination, not accessibility measures, and perhaps the technocrats intention is to resolve the problem in preventing disabled to attend… I already know one (and probably will hear of more when I will be there) disabled competitor deciding after the bad last year’s experience, to only shoot this year the Queens instead as the full Grand Aggregate….

Also, cars are allowed on Century for valids during the Team Matches..Is this not a wonderful example of incoherence?

Discrimination exist also between MR shooters and TR/F-Class; as the formers, shooting 1000+ can park their adapted cars immediately behind their targets…

Maybe it is NR/ANSC technocrats intention to get rid of the disabled problem, as well making prohibitive the presence of trade exhibitors to reduce them to nil? We call such an attitude in French ‘’Faire le nettoyage par le vide’’!!.

BTW, you mention the trade stands absence problem for UK shooters only, who have alternatives with other shows throughout the country, but you ignore the foreing visitors who have the Imperial as single possibility of their attendance to the Imperial to see what the British trade has to offer, and use the Norman’s helping services.

R.G.C

R.G.C wrote:Sensible stuff re disabled shooters

The NRA wants to be <very> careful about this, before they find themselves in a world of hurt.