The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

Sim G wrote:

Chuck wrote:Round chambered and hammer down, ideal carry condition for a personal defence weapon.

Which ostensibly is how the Glock is carried......

Chuck wrote:Interesting the Swiss (and I think Belgians) have never had this problem in over 10 years!

And the Swiss and the Belgians have seen how much combat over the last 10 years....?

considering that most of the debate about Glocks seems to be based on the US LEO issue experience, "combat" would seem irrelevent razz PS the Belgiums had troops in Afghan, the Swiss are far too sensible to have bothered, although Swiss troops have served as Peacekeepers.

Yes I'm aware of the Belgians in Afghanistan, they provided the main thrust of security at Kabul airport and the Swiss provided 200 peacekeepers to Kosovo...

I imagine US LEO's have actually had far more "combat" experience than either the Belgians or Swiss...!

Round chambered and hammer down, ideal carry condition for a personal defence weapon.

The Glock doesn't have a hammer.

NYPD, well not exactly shining examples of good gun handling are they

How much training do you think the average soldier will
get on the Glock.

In 1988, the FBI predicted that the Glock's sensitive trigger and lack of external safeties would "inevitably ... lead to an unintentional shot at the worst moment." Indeed, 11 years later, the Washington DC Police Department alone had had 120 accidental firings, 19 officers had wounded themselves or others with Glocks, and the district had paid $1.4 million in damages from resulting lawsuits related to Glock accidents. In one case, an officer shot and killed an unarmed teen at a DC roadblock. Another officer accidentally shot and killed an unarmed motorist during a routine traffic stop. One DC cop accidentally shot his own roommate.

Call it what you want poor training whatever all I am saying is that the number of N/D-S will go up. That has being the experience of most police forces that have introduced the Glock. I doint see why the army will be any different. I have owned a Glock so know the characteristics of the firearm. I didn't like it and bought a CZ 75 SPO1.

ordnance wrote:

Round chambered and hammer down, ideal carry condition for a personal defence weapon.

The Glock doesn't have a hammer.

NYPD, well not exactly shining examples of good gun handling are they

How much training do you think the average soldier will
get on the Glock.

if they don't get enough training to be able to use the Glock safely then they shouldn't have use of a pistol full stop! if they can't get their heads around a simple concept such as "pull trigger gun go's bang" then how are they going to remember to take the safety off or use the decocker correctly on any other type of pistol? and thats without talking about pistols that won't fire when the mag is loose due to the mag release being hit by mistake! better to bring back the .455 Webley's ! the Glock is a simple pistol to use, you pick it up, point it and pull the trigger, ideal for use by minimally trained personel, that and cost is one of the things that endears it to the military and law enforcement.

In 1988, the FBI predicted that the Glock's sensitive trigger and lack of external safeties would "inevitably ... lead to an unintentional shot at the worst moment." Indeed, 11 years later, the Washington DC Police Department alone had had 120 accidental firings, 19 officers had wounded themselves or others with Glocks, and the district had paid $1.4 million in damages from resulting lawsuits related to Glock accidents. In one case, an officer shot and killed an unarmed teen at a DC roadblock. Another officer accidentally shot and killed an unarmed motorist during a routine traffic stop. One DC cop accidentally shot his own roommate.

[/quote]

another cherry picked quote
Yet the department stinted on training for recruits and failed to keep veteran officers to a twice-yearly retraining schedule that experts consider the bare minimum for firearms competence. A Washington Post investigation found that 75 percent of all D.C. officers involved in shootings during 1996 failed to comply with the retraining regulation. One officer waited so long to come to the range that firearms instructors found a spider nest growing inside his Glock.

Several factors contributed to this neglect, including the reluctance of hard-pressed commanders to spare officers from street duty, lapses on the part of officers themselves, problems with lead contamination that shut down the shooting range in the early 1990s and poor management, according to interviews with officials and independent studies of the department.

D.C. police officials repeatedly studied the phenomenon of accidental discharges, invariably concluding that there was no fundamental problem with the Glock itself – as long as users were properly trained. Officials chose not to modify the Glock trigger, as New York City police did in 1990, to require a more forceful tug to fire the gun. In 1994, D.C. police recorded more accidental discharges than the Chicago or Los Angeles forces, two far bigger departments, according to discharge records from the departments. Last year, the accident rate for D.C. police was 50 percent greater than that of New York police.

you see the problem with the internet is it allows people to back whichever side of an argument they want with quotes from "informed sources " tongueout

ordnance wrote:

Round chambered and hammer down, ideal carry condition for a personal defence weapon.

The Glock doesn't have a hammer.

NYPD, well not exactly shining examples of good gun handling are they

How much training do you think the average soldier will
get on the Glock.

In 1988, the FBI predicted that the Glock's sensitive trigger and lack of external safeties would "inevitably ... lead to an unintentional shot at the worst moment." Indeed, 11 years later, the Washington DC Police Department alone had had 120 accidental firings, 19 officers had wounded themselves or others with Glocks, and the district had paid $1.4 million in damages from resulting lawsuits related to Glock accidents. In one case, an officer shot and killed an unarmed teen at a DC roadblock. Another officer accidentally shot and killed an unarmed motorist during a routine traffic stop. One DC cop accidentally shot his own roommate.

Call it what you want poor training whatever all I am saying is that the number of N/D-S will go up. That has being the experience of most police forces that have introduced the Glock. I doint see why the army will be any different. I have owned a Glock so know the characteristics of the firearm. I didn't like it and bought a CZ 75 SPO1. Time will tell.

if they don't get enough training to be able to use the Glock safely then they shouldn't have use of a pistol full stop! if they can't get their heads around a simple concept such as "pull trigger gun go's bang"

What would you call enough training. ? If all they need to know is that if you pull the trigger it will go bang, that shouldn't take to long.

ordnance wrote:

if they don't get enough training to be able to use the Glock safely then they shouldn't have use of a pistol full stop! if they can't get their heads around a simple concept such as "pull trigger gun go's bang"

What would you call enough training. ? If all they need to know is that if you pull the trigger it will go bang, that shouldn't take to long.

as long as they know not to point it at themselves or their collegues and pull the trigger would be a start tesnews

Mezzer wrote:Why did anyone think that letting an army sergeant from the Queen Alexandra's Royal Army Nursing Corp anywhere near an anti-tank weapon would be a good idea! I cannot imagine any particular surgical procedure that would require the use of an 84mm (I may be showing my age here). It's a bit like having sailors and RAF types running around with guns

Mezzer

You cheeky little s*d! LOL. Here is one sailor that never managed to shoot anyone with my Browning, Sterling, SLR, Bofors, 4.5 inch Naval gun, 6 inch Naval Gun. Some say that I and Sailors in general couldn't hit a barn door anyway before anyone chips in. Had lots of 'accidental discharges' but the naval doctors/sick berth attendants just gave me penicillin.

This is my Glock 21 in 45ACP, had it a few years now and put lots and lots of rounds down range with it. I even carry it depending on where I'm going. Thing is in all the time I've had it I've never had an ND simply for a couple of reasons.
1. Before I do anything with it the first thing I do is magazine out, pull the working parts back and check it's unloaded then magazine back in, chamber a round and into the correct fitting holster, it's also unloaded before it comes back in the house.
2. I keep my finger off the trigger until it is pointing at the target and ready to shoot.
3. I don't fcuk about with it loaded or unloaded.

Blu