Club FAC - multiple ticket holders

[nickb834]

Is anyone here a member of a club that has multiple club ticket holders?

Can anyone point me in the direction of any guidance issued by the Home Office that says that no longer should multiple holders of a club FAC be permitted - I can find no such evidence.

West Yorkshire Police are stating that they no longer issue such tickets and that a club can only have one holder.

I disagree with this view point but I'm interested if anyone has any relevant info on this front before I go back to argue the difference.

Nick

[saddler]

Ask THEM to highlight that part of the Guidance & other relevant Acts for you

Sounds like bollox to me - past club, ANY club member could access/borrow club guns & the like without being on the club FAC (for one example)

[nickb834]

Cheers - what we're trying to achieve is multiple club fac holders such that we're not totally reliant on one person to purchase club ammo or purhcase / dispose of club firearms (we're forever short on ammo and the club fac holder is not always available to sort this - I'm being fairly generous here ;-) )

We don't have a problem currently with members using club guns not on their own FAC (to be fair this rarely happens as our club guns are mostly.......un-good).

[nickb834]

Right - I've read through this top to bottom:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... aw_v13.pdf

I beleive it's the latest version (March 2015) - there's nothing in there that deals in any way with mutliple club FAC holders. Interestingly it does however mention in section 18.32 that as of January 2015 - a club's Home Office.....

Letters of approval are issued in the name of the club and state the club secretary’s and,
from 1 January 2015, another designated responsible officer’s name and address

So - I'm probably going to point out the fact that if a clubs approval now requires another responsible officers name and address (no reason given, presumably such that there will always be one contactable / responsible officer) - then surely, a Club requires at least a secondary FAC holder for it's firearms for the exact same reason.

In addition there's nothing in law that specifically prohibits nor mentions exactly what it is we're looking to achieve.

I forsee me having to get familiar with the complaints process.

[meles meles]

A letter to the Chief Constabubble, asking him / her to explain how and why the underlings don't understand the law they are entrusted to enforce always works wonders for us, ooman.

[Mattnall]

You should only need one club FAC. If the holder is not up to the job get another officer to become the holder.
As most of your club shoot their own firearms because the club's guns are mostly "un-good" then couldn't they purchase their own ammo and even pass it on to the other club members? OK there will be a bit of paperwork but that's not a too onerous job for ammunition transfers only.

If multiple FACs for clubs was a regular thing then I would recommend all my club members get one as it would be free. I can just see the Firearms Department up in arms and wanting to charge a fortune to the hunters with no club to cover the cost of the free certificates to all the club FAC holders.

[nickb834]

You should only need one club FAC. If the holder is not up to the job get another officer to become the holder.
As most of your club shoot their own firearms because the club's guns are mostly "un-good" then couldn't they purchase their own ammo and even pass it on to the other club members? OK there will be a bit of paperwork but that's not a too onerous job for ammunition transfers only.

If multiple FACs for clubs was a regular thing then I would recommend all my club members get one as it would be free. I can just see the Firearms Department up in arms and wanting to charge a fortune to the hunters with no club to cover the cost of the free certificates to all the club FAC holders.

"Should only need one club fac" - except what we're trying to do is take all the pressure and effort off of one individual members shoulders and spread the load. We're all busy people these days and it's unfair to expect one member to have to do it all (even if sometimes they could do it and just don't quite get around to it).

Multiple FACs for clubs is a topic discussed on here before - it does go on, it's not something new we're trying to do here - indeed West Yorkshire police indicated that "we don't do that anymore" - which is interesting because I haven't seen any primary legislation that made such a change to the law.....

You have to remember the club FAC covers the clubs own guns - not your own - so what would be the point in abusing it? It's self regulating.

Finally - I respect your opinion but I am confused by it - you'd rather a club wasn't able to make things a little easier on it's members, and in so doing ensure that firearms and ammo were always in a good state of repair and in stock? To what end?

To whose benefit is it to restrict club fac's? They're free as mandated in law - and you can't issue one to someone who isn't a member of a club, and they only cover club guns - what's a good reason not to issue one?

[Kungfugerbil]

^ If they continue to be difficult, say "Ok then, I want authority for 50,000 rounds of ammo on my own ticket please" and see what they say :)

[ChrisB]

Your club should have one FAC. On this FAC is recorded Primary Locations where each of the club firearms and ammo are kept..AFAIK...

[nickb834]

Your club should have one FAC. On this FAC is recorded Primary Locations where each of the club firearms and ammo are kept..AFAIK...

You are indeed of course correct - but how does that help me [confused]

Consider this - what's the difference between me and my wife sharing a cabinet and both having the exact same guns on our tickets - and multiple club members having the same club guns, stored in the same location on their own "club" tickets (as legally distinct from personal FAC)......