Reloading Confusion

[tarantulaman]

Some measurements, let me know if I have missed anything.

COL - 2.925

Bullet diameter - 0.3084

Case neck diameter - This is where it gets interesting. aaarggh

Four cases (where is the correct place to take the measurement?):
1) calipers just into neck - 0.296 -- calipers deep into neck - 0.308
2) calipers just into neck - 0.304 -- calipers deep into neck - 0.308
3) calipers just into neck - 0.304 -- calipers deep into neck - 0.308
4) calipers just into neck - 0.295 -- calipers deep into neck - 0.308

It seems a little strange that the outer part of the neck is narrower than deeper into the neck, is this normal as to me it looks like only the outer part of the neck can possibly be gripping the bullet?

[HALODIN]

.303 --> .304 is correct based on some new .308 Lapua brass I have in front of me. A smaller neck than that won't cause you the problem, where the bullet just drops in to the case. I think you're going to have to keep measurements of everything and then see if you get the problem again, making sure you mark each case and bullet so you can identify what combination of components produces the slack neck issue.

[HALODIN]

I suppose it's worth clarifying one point here - Are those readings before or after resizing? I would guess after, but I shouldn't assume.

[tarantulaman]

They are after resizing.

[HALODIN]

OK thanks. If it was me, I'd measure the diameter of 20 bullets and the inside of 20 case necks just after resizing, to see if they're within an acceptable tolerance and try again. I think you need to double check your seating die plug depth, as the COAL looks completely different between the 2 rounds on the left.

http://www.full-bore.co.uk/download/fil ... &mode=view

[Dougan]

Some measurements, let me know if I have missed anything.

COL - 2.925

Bullet diameter - 0.3084

Case neck diameter - This is where it gets interesting. aaarggh

Four cases (where is the correct place to take the measurement?):
1) calipers just into neck - 0.296 -- calipers deep into neck - 0.308
2) calipers just into neck - 0.304 -- calipers deep into neck - 0.308
3) calipers just into neck - 0.304 -- calipers deep into neck - 0.308
4) calipers just into neck - 0.295 -- calipers deep into neck - 0.308

It seems a little strange that the outer part of the neck is narrower than deeper into the neck, is this normal as to me it looks like only the outer part of the neck can possibly be gripping the bullet?

Measuring the inside of case necks is tricky; especially just into the neck, where it's hard to tell if you've got the calipers lined up exactly right with the case - I think you get a more accurate measurement by going deeper as it lines everything up better, and if you think about it the calipers will still stop at the narrowest point (always rotate whatever you're measuring to make sure of this).

So looking at your measurements - Your bullet one looks about right (SMKs can measure slightly over the exact caliber, though if you rotate and take several measurements it can be hard to tell exactly down to 0.0000 depending on how good your calipers are) - If your 'deep into the neck' measurements are correct, then that would be the problem; as there would be very little difference between the bullet and the case neck; maybe only the difference between a clean case and a dirty inside case neck...

...I would measure the expander ball - just unscrew the die and pull it out and measure the widest part of the expander...also have a look to see how clean it is; or is there a built up of lubey crud on it from the case necks.

[Dougan]

Thanks again everyone, some great tips

However this is still confusing as the Redding instructions only mention lowering the die until it touches the shell holder, not a case. Are Redding dies different in this regard?

Alpha1 - Don't worry, I am not intending to shoot any of these until I am confident they are safe. I have the Lee reloading manual which is pretty good. Also I have now asked a friend (experienced reloader) to also take a look at my setup.

It is proving to be a good learning exercise though and at least I do understand that I am making mistakes and that these rounds are not safe.

I am going to Bisley next weekend so will just buy some more factory rounds for then if I can't get this resolved. There is no way I would jeopardize my own safety or that of others.

Also my club now uses a chronograph and visual inspection before you are allowed to use reloads. We have to sign to state what components/powder charge we are using and the expected velocity and muzzle energy.

Thanks again

Hmmm; interesting - While I feel that screwing the die down onto the cases lets you know exactly where the crimping part is in relation to the cases you're actually using; logically there's no reason why those instruction wouldn't work, as the dies are made caliber specific...but it does assume that cases are the right length and all shell-holders are the same height etc...

...this has made me curious...I'll be doing some case prep later in the week so will compare the two different ways of setting up the seating die, with different makes of shell holder and see what difference (if any?) it makes...I'll get back to you on that one.

Btw: Despite not getting the right results yet, you have recognised this for yourself, and are doing the right thing by not being embarrassed to ask questions and ask for help (I'd take Ovenpaa up on his offer...)...I'm sure it won't be long until you're making some quality ammo

[tarantulaman]

OK thanks. If it was me, I'd measure the diameter of 20 bullets and the inside of 20 case necks just after resizing, to see if they're within an acceptable tolerance and try again. I think you need to double check your seating die plug depth, as the COAL looks completely different between the 2 rounds on the left.

http://www.full-bore.co.uk/download/fil ... &mode=view

Thanks HALODIN, the round on the left is a 174gn PPU factory round, while the others are my 168gn reloads.

[tarantulaman]

Thanks Dougan, I probably won't have time to try and measure the expander ball until after the weekend. But great point about the 'lube crud', I will certainly investigate that. I just need to work out how to dismantle the die.

I will also measure the lengths of lots of the cases to see of there is a difference there, I still have my doubts about the Lee trimmer.

Anyway, I am off to Bisley this weekend, shooting 600 & 900 yards. Should be fun with the K31 , I will be using 174gn PPU rounds so hopefully they will be good for that distance. Even more importantly, I hope the weather is good.

Cheers,

Dave

[bradaz11]

i hate my lee quick trim. it seemed to do one or two calibres ok. but when trying it with 303 brass it justseemed to cut way too much off and chamfer it to a fine point. so anyone that wants 44, 45acp, 38, 303 and 357 (i think) quick trim dies, let me know

the lee case length trimmers with the arbour and shell holder is definately best. I wound up buying the cutter with ball handle, 3 jaw chuck and adapter, with that in a drill in 1st gear, it made trimming the 303 brass a pleasure, not a chore. oh, i also bought the Lyman combination chamfer, pocket cleaning tool.