Morbid Subject

[ColinR]

As an FAC holder with 6 rifles and ammunition living on his own I wonder what is the situation should I die?

The keys to my cabinets are secreted in the house and as the law states are inaccessible and their whereabouts unknown to anyone else.

Everything is left to another FAC holder in my Will, but what happens in the interim?

[Dombo63]

Make prior arrangement with your local RFD to receive the rifles and ammunition at the necessary time. Leave a "In the event of" letter with your solicitor, explaining where the keys and FAC are and giving details of the RFD.
Solicitor or executor or whomever then takes the cabinet contents straight to RFD for safekeeping. Beneficiary puts in for variations for the calibres you have bequeathed and collects from RFD once variations come through and probate etc is settled.
I am not an expert on firearms law or any other legal matters, so happy to be corrected, but the above would seem to be the most sensible option.

[Chapuis]

No need to involve a RFD if the solicitor contacts the beneficiary and he/she applies for a temporary permit until his/her variation comes through they can take imediate possession.

[froggy]

wtfwtf

What ? You don't intend to be burnt with your favourite rifle ??
Without, I seriously doubt the Valkyries will consider taking you to Walhalla and even if they do, Colin, please be prepare for serious sniggering in Asgard ...

[Blackstuff]

Simple, the police will search your house and if they can't find your keys they'll break into your storage. If its a cabinet they'll be in, in a few minutes, if its a safe maybe a couple of hours. IF your solicitor/estate actually get to find out you owned guns they'd then have an uphill battle getting them from the police to sell, if they did not, the guns would be destroyed.

#Sunshine on a rainy day.....# :lol:

[25Pdr]

At our last AGM I made a proposal that members could lodge a spare set of gun cabinet keys with the Club Secretary (Moi! ) with instructions that in the event of their death the Secretary would dispose of the guns as he seen fit.

The Vote was....

0 - No!
55 - Feck Off!.

One can but try. :lol:

[zanes]

Simple, the police will search your house and if they can't find your keys they'll break into your storage. If its a cabinet they'll be in, in a few minutes, if its a safe maybe a couple of hours. IF your solicitor/estate actually get to find out you owned guns they'd then have an uphill battle getting them from the police to sell, if they did not, the guns would be destroyed.

#Sunshine on a rainy day.....# :lol:

Has this actually happened when someone's died, do you know (not a "mate of a mate" or "here's half the story forum post")?

I always thought that a section 7 in this circumstance was pretty automatic; in fact I'm sure I've seen an ad somewhere from an RFD that basically operates a "call us if your loved one dies with an FAC/SGC and we'll do the paperwork" (presumably either for a cost or comission sale, but still. In fact thinking about it they were offering the same for section 5 ("grandads old war trophy" type stuff) too). It's certainly well covered in the guidance.

I suspect (given that most shooters spouses would be at least half clued up on the law/lie of the land, or it would come out through a "guess what the police just did" chat when said spouse was notifying your shooting mates) that a firearms licensing authority that routinely sent a couple of coppers round to rough up the house of a grieving widow and then take an angle grinder to a safe/item of furniture before seizing property and destroying it would have a pretty rough time of it.

Especially as (IME, of course) most FEOs/authorities seem very reasonable (unless you've massively breached your licence conditions/made threats/been arrested for something serious which is, of course, not the subject of this thread).

In any case, given that the guns would be safely tucked up in their safe, I suspect notifying the police of a cert holders death is probably a fair way down most peoples priorities. Also, how many relatives/estates don't at least know "I'm sure he had guns in the house"- I would imagine for many (as most are a significant asset) they're explicitly mentioned in the will.

That being said, I must leave instructions on this subject. Time for a "just in case" letter I think.

Probably worth mentioning that this sort of thing must happen every day, given number of SGC/FAC holders, so it's not like the firearms office would implode in a "what the f*** do we do" storm.

I could perhaps just about see this scenario if someone with no family/beneficiaries after enquiries had been made died, but then (and it sounds terrible to say this, given how many of our old folks die alone) who would really care?

TL;DR: I doubt it. Got a link?

[Chapuis]

What paperwork?
In my experience with the local force the firearms department are very reasonable and considerate. Obviously they have to ensure that the firearms remain secure firstly, but they do every thing in their power to ensure that the matter is dealt with with the least amount of fuss and hassle for the people concerned. A simple phone call is all that is required to get the temporary permit issued as rapidly as possible. That is asuming that the deceased has left directions as to where his firearms should go when he dies.

[zanes]

What paperwork?
In my experience with the local force the firearms department are very reasonable and considerate. Obviously they have to ensure that the firearms remain secure firstly, but they do every thing in their power to ensure that the matter is dealt with with the least amount of fuss and hassle for the people concerned. A simple phone call is all that is required to get the temporary permit issued as rapidly as possible. That is asuming that the deceased has left directions as to where his firearms should go when he dies.

In fairness it might have been more a "call us and we'll talk you through the process" or "call us and we'll liaise with your licensing dept" type message. At well under 30 I didn't give the ad all that much attention other than "oh, that's a neat niche they've got themselves". I certainly can't remember the publication or RFD, before someone asks.

Whilst it's simple enough for us (and in fairness any RFD could do much the same), for people who don't know a huge amount about firearms law and aren't exactly at their best given the circumstances I could see it being welcome service, particularly if there's no real interest in the firearms other than doing the "right thing" and realising a fair value for the estate. I was using that as an example to illustrate the ease of dealing with this situation and the improbability of the police turning up unannounced, searching the entire house for keys and then smashing the cabinets in and stealing the contents.

However, if I had to guess on a course of action most people would take they'd probably default to a call to the local licensing department (who'll probably get hugely excited, get the enforcer/riot helmets/angle grinder out, then calm down and remember it's much less hassle to issue a section 7 :lol: )

As you rightfully point out, it's well worth us all making arrangements, even if it's just "call this number, ask for a section 7, get them to this RFD to sell, here's the rough values you should be looking for". The latter would be my bigger worry; relatives getting ripped off by an RFD.

[Chapuis]

I've actually left instructions in my will as to what my family should do and who to contact as I'm sure that when the time comes they will go blank on the subject in spite of knowing what I have done on behalf of friends in the past.