New Petition - Part 2 (Number of signatures: 13,188)

[M1Charles1M]

One word - Participation. Playing around in the virtual world don't really cut it or count chap!
Take part - 10,000 people shooting a national competition counts more than a 1000 and certainly counts more than web box ticking.

Why does it have to be an either, or choice? I strongly advocate that both are valid in non-discriminatory support of shooting.

[Demonic69]

So - you coming to any shooting competitions and events this year? Phoenix, Imperial, Winter CSR leagues, CPSA registered clay shoots, Practical shotgun matches, historics matches etc - any others? Plenty in the calendars of the appropriate organising bodies.

Yep, got my Mosin ready and my S1 shotgun on it's way ready for some competitions later in the year, though I'll not be heading to Bisley as it's a bit far for me and can't justify the expense and time away from the kids to SWMBO.
Still not sure how that will convince a politician with no visibility or interest in sport participation numbers though.

[M1Charles1M]

Sendit - suggest you ask the NRA to send a members email too as that will reach far more people and get a more positive response

Love

karen

Karen, thank you yes, that was part of my original conversation with NRA. They felt unable to do so at the time of that conversation. I will wait to see if they take that initiative.

[M1Charles1M]

So - you coming to any shooting competitions and events this year? Phoenix, Imperial, Winter CSR leagues, CPSA registered clay shoots, Practical shotgun matches, historics matches etc - any others? Plenty in the calendars of the appropriate organising bodies.

Yep, got my Mosin ready and my S1 shotgun on it's way ready for some competitions later in the year, though I'll not be heading to Bisley as it's a bit far for me and can't justify the expense and time away from the kids to SWMBO.
Still not sure how that will convince a politician with no visibility or interest in sport participation numbers though.

A simple observation. Yes it can be a political poison chalice, but we are not without support in both Houses of Parliament!

[nfrancis]

Well mate your expectations and reality are two different things now. It isn't just about attending organised shoots which are a part of it, it's also about getting out there with your club on shooting days or booking a range and getting out with a couple of mates or five or six. It's about helping to set up things like youth days and other club events to name but a few to get new blood in.

Its about keeping 'new blood' in as well.

With regards to the Phoenix, Imperial and Trafalgar shoots, not everybody has the time due to family or the money to attend those shoots and not everybody lives close to where those shoots are held. I believe that the sport starts at grassroot level and that is the bread and butter of the sport, not the Phoenix or the Imperial nor the Trafalgar or organised shoots for that matter though I have stated they are a part of it, but not a big part of it.

Well - I'm hearing the usual excuses here for not shooting here :-(

I'd argue the Phoenix or the Imperial or the Trafalgar or any other organised shoot are the grassroots of the sport.

[M1Charles1M]

Well mate your expectations and reality are two different things now. It isn't just about attending organised shoots which are a part of it, it's also about getting out there with your club on shooting days or booking a range and getting out with a couple of mates or five or six. It's about helping to set up things like youth days and other club events to name but a few to get new blood in.

Its about keeping 'new blood' in as well.

With regards to the Phoenix, Imperial and Trafalgar shoots, not everybody has the time due to family or the money to attend those shoots and not everybody lives close to where those shoots are held. I believe that the sport starts at grassroot level and that is the bread and butter of the sport, not the Phoenix or the Imperial nor the Trafalgar or organised shoots for that matter though I have stated they are a part of it, but not a big part of it.

Well - I'm hearing the usual excuses here for not shooting here :-(

I'd argue the Phoenix or the Imperial or the Trafalgar or any other organised shoot are the grassroots of the sport.

I would agree with the point about taking part, but then so is shooting at any club level for that is where new participants are likely enter and perpetuate all disciplines, including yours. Another fact remains Social Media is a powerful tool for good or evil, but a tool non the less, and I will use it to the best advantage in my support for shooting sports, and yes I shoot GR too!

[nfrancis]

Why does it have to be an either, or choice? I strongly advocate that both are valid in non-discriminatory support of shooting.

It doesn't - but it is isn't it? And why? Well - we are offering way too many people the easy way out. Sign this petition and you've done your bit for the next 2 years to save the sport'. No chance... It takes a lot more effort than that to save anything.

I hear as many excuses and arguments for not coming shooting as you seem to be hearing from the likes of me for not apparently wanting to support this 'yet another on-line petition ' petition.

Petitions like this are the opium of the masses - the very politicians you are decrying are loving the fact that we continue to offer them this easy way out. Yet another 'here today gone tomorrow' petition for the average 'here today gone tomorrow politician' to ignore.

Just go shooting, encourage more people to go shooting, do more shooting. How many here encouraged as many people to come to a shoot they would not have usually attend as they did to sign this petition?

[M1Charles1M]

Why does it have to be an either, or choice? I strongly advocate that both are valid in non-discriminatory support of shooting.

It doesn't - but it is isn't it? And why? Well - we are offering way too many people the easy way out. Sign this petition and you've done your bit for the next 2 years to save the sport'. No chance... It takes a lot more effort than that to save anything.

I hear as many excuses and arguments for not coming shooting as you seem to be hearing from the likes of me for not apparently wanting to support this 'yet another on-line petition ' petition.

Petitions like this are the opium of the masses - the very politicians you are decrying are loving the fact that we continue to offer them this easy way out. Yet another 'here today gone tomorrow' petition for the average 'here today gone tomorrow politician' to ignore.

Just go shooting, encourage more people to go shooting, do more shooting. How many here encouraged as many people to come to a shoot they would not have usually attend as they did to sign this petition?

I understand some of the points you make about involvement and participation, or lack of, but that is not about shooting sports in isolation, that is just human nature and good luck with trying to combat that. I will where I may, and by what means I have available simply try to influence it!

The Unity Campaign, as I have stated previously is not a petition in isolation, it is an ongoing campaign that will see other initiatives introduced in a timely manner over the next twelve months, some of which are directly aimed at your points of contention.

The petition is a means to an end, not the end itself. I am sorry you feel unable to support it but I respect that that is your prerogative.

[nfrancis]

Nfrancis.

What is your view on shooters who do not compete but still shoot regularly?

Depends what they are shooting.

Use of firearms for practical reasons such as vermin control or animal management aside - if your primary reason for owning firearms is listed as target shooting you probably need to be target shooting to justify its ownership. If anyone says thay want a firearm for target shooting - why wouldn't they go target shooting?

At the moment most police areas seem to accept this as turning up to a club a couple of times a year and 'signing in'. Fine - this was always the case - even before the laws changed in the 1990s.

However one day something will happen again in this country and firearms ownership will, as usual, be called into question. Worst case scenario is if you are not really target shooting you may well have difficulty in justifying ownership of that firearm. I don't really count aimless pinking as target shooting.

So - my views - well - I could argue that they are the sport's worst nightmares because when something does happen again we'll have 2 million Daily Mail readers crying for blood on the basis we had thousands of gun nuts who had no real justification or reason to hold 'an arsenal of lethal weapons' when they never actually went target shooting. That's my sport down the pan. I could probably take up clay shooting however!

Alternatively I could argue they are missing out on 90% of what shooting is all about. Essentially the same as any other sport or pastime - football, cricket, basketball, darts, chess - whatever... Competition is what shooting sports are - its not about guns (contrary to popular belief) its about shooting.

Reality is somewhere in the middle although I do have serious reservations about why people want guns for target shooting and then don't go target shooting. People who are more interested in guns than shooting worry me - they should probably worry everyone.

[zanes]

Nfrancis.

What is your view on shooters who do not compete but still shoot regularly?

Depends what they are shooting.

Use of firearms for practical reasons such as vermin control or animal management aside - if your primary reason for owning firearms is listed as target shooting you probably need to be target shooting to justify its ownership. If anyone says thay want a firearm for target shooting - why wouldn't they go target shooting?

At the moment most police areas seem to accept this as turning up to a club a couple of times a year and 'signing in'. Fine - this was always the case - even before the laws changed in the 1990s.

However one day something will happen again in this country and firearms ownership will, as usual, be called into question. Worst case scenario is if you are not really target shooting you may well have difficulty in justifying ownership of that firearm. I don't really count aimless pinking as target shooting.

So - my views - well - I could argue that they are the sport's worst nightmares because when something does happen again we'll have 2 million Daily Mail readers crying for blood on the basis we had thousands of gun nuts who had no real justification or reason to hold 'an arsenal of lethal weapons' when they never actually went target shooting. That's my sport down the pan. I could probably take up clay shooting however!

Alternatively I could argue they are missing out on 90% of what shooting is all about. Essentially the same as any other sport or pastime - football, cricket, basketball, darts, chess - whatever... Competition is what shooting sports are - its not about guns (contrary to popular belief) its about shooting.

Reality is somewhere in the middle although I do have serious reservations about why people want guns for target shooting and then don't go target shooting. People who are more interested in guns than shooting worry me - they should probably worry everyone.

I think you're confusing "people who don't shoot targets regularly (who you are talking about)" with "people who shoot targets regularly and don't compete (which is who Dromia talk about)". I note the home office appreciate the distinction (with regularly being guideline of 3 times a year or greater). Target shooting in this sense does not mean competitive target shooting.

However, I would agree that competition adds a certain something to my shooting experience (note the emphasis...). Having said that, some firearms are not owned for competition potential (much as I am applying for a .303 slot- I'll be target shooting with it, but that'll be more about the historical "experience"). I doubt you'll get far arguing that people such as me should hand them in

And that's before we talk about reenactors, collectors etc etc