Carl Gustav 96 Swede.

[Blu]

Dougan, when you say "sooting up the chamber", does the brass have soot on when extracted?

and would be very interested in what you've found so far

Do you mean with regards to load testing?

Blu

[Dougan]

Dougan, when you say "sooting up the chamber", does the brass have soot on when extracted?

and would be very interested in what you've found so far

Do you mean with regards to load testing?

Blu

Yes, and yes...

But there's more to it than that - The sooting is now only when I try to use new brass (possibly due to the light loads not expanding the cases) - I can eliminate the sooting, by neck-sizing once fired factory ammo... but then as I use them, the cases seem to be expanding (outwards in the rear third) but not reducing back again, so that after 2 reloads they are becoming so stiff (not just a slight crush fit) in the chamber, that they need full sizing again...

...the other thing, which I'm interested in, is your opinion on the recommended seating depths for 6.5 x 55 swedish - In the Viht manual it gives a C.O.L for SMKs at 3.110...this only has a tiny bit of the bullet's bearing surface in the neck; so no good for running through the magazine as not sturdy enough...at the moment I'm using a C.O.L of 3.080, which is a compromise between the manual and factory rounds I've measured...

...have you had and C.O.L issues? What are your manuals telling you?...and have you noticed any other quirks loading for it? (My only other FB loading experience is with .303...which seems a piece of p*** in comparison).

[Blu]

Dougan,

But there's more to it than that - The sooting is now only when I try to use new brass (possibly due to the light loads not expanding the cases) - I can eliminate the sooting, by neck-sizing once fired factory ammo... but then as I use them, the cases seem to be expanding (outwards in the rear third) but not reducing back again, so that after 2 reloads they are becoming so stiff (not just a slight crush fit) in the chamber, that they need full sizing again..

Yeah I put it down to too light a load as well, when I first started shooting the Swede. I wanted to get a feel for it and so I used what bullets I had to hand and they were mostly 120Grn bullets from different makers along with some Hornady 129Grn SST and Soft Points (SP) and I was using Viht powder. Now then here's the thing, I wasn't too impressed with the results using the Viht powders I used so I gave Reloader 19 a try and hey presto, no more soot and much better results with Nosler, Hornady and Sierra bullets. Also the case volume from RE 19 was a little more as well as opposed to to Viht of roughly the same weight powder.

The Hornady bullets gave the best results by far in so much I was shooting clover sized and better groups at a hundred and two hundred yards. Saying that though I have just started loading the heavier 140Grn bullets and again, so far, I have found that both the Hornady 140Grn SST and SP bullets are giving me great results with Reloader 19 as well, although I am still tweaking those loads. The COL for those is 3.026, for the lighter 129Grn bullets the COL is 3.035.

I can only speak for the rifle I have but it seems to love the Hornady bullets the most. If you fancy giving any of the other bullets a try and don't have load data for them then just let me know and I can scan the data into PDF formats for you to use, that's assuming you want to try something other than SMK bullets.


If you are going to continue using Smk bullets I'd maybe seat them a little deeper as 3.110 does seem a little long to me but just watch the pressure though, but I'd be willing to bet it's got a lot to do with Viht powder. So far though I have never had a problem with cases but then saying that I only use a FL sizing die once after the first shooting, trim them, and thereafter I run them through the RCBS X-Die, I have to say I use X-Dies on all my rifles and they are bloody marvelous at prolonging case life and they do away with repeated trimming but don't stretch the case as much as a FL dies does.

Blu

[Blu]

Oh forgot to say, a while back I did some looking on the net about soot on the brass, and guess what? Nearly all of the shooters were using light bullets, light loads, and they were all using Viht powder.

Blu

[Dougan]

Cheers for the information Blu - It's prompted me to consult the Lyman manual (which I think your COLs match), which is something I should have done earlier...

I was using N150 before (too fast I think?), and have recently switched to N160 (as it was recommended by several people) - My first test was good (no sooting), but was using my best once-fired cases which are a good fit....

However I was following the Viht manual for a 140 HPBT (SMK) which has a minimum of 43.4 to a max of 46.7, but seating at COL 3.080 instead of 3.110 - I tried 3 batches of 43, 43.4 and 44....the first two were good but felt a bit strong, and then with the 44s I got a few stiff lifts (oh er!) so stopped...

...now when you look at the Lyman manual - for a 140 HPBT (non-specified) it gives a COL of 3.050, and with N160 it starts at 39.5 up to a max of 44.0!

Now I'll concede that in my inexperience I've underestimated the pressure differences that 30 thou more seating depth can make, but it doesn't help us relative beginners to have such varying data in different manuals...if you combine the data you can load anything from a light load that releases the bullet even before case expansion, to a load that could cause damage....

Anyway, I'm going to ditch the Viht manual for 6.5 sweedish and go with the Lyman as the COLs seem to be similar to what you're using, and the lower powder loads also match what Dromia was recommending on another thread.

Sorry to hijack this a bit, but swopping loading notes for the Swede like this has helped to clear a few things up for me.... mate! :cheers:

[Blu]

Dougan, having never seen the Viht manual does it say that the loads should be used with caution in the old Carl Gustav rifles as it does in the manuals of the companies such as Nosler, Speer, Hornady and the rest of them. Speer in fact has two separate reloading pages/groups for the 6.5 Swede, one for modern commercial rifles and one for the old service rifle. I've noticed that COL's are different depending on the rifle.

Blu

[Dougan]

No there's no warning - Just says: "Test barrel: 26.5", 1 in 8.5 twist" - And the more I look at it the less suitable the instructions seem for an old (104 years!) mil-surp...

...When I first bought it, I got some Lapua scenars to try, but apart from the fact that the extra bearing surface makes 3 gn difference to the starting load; if you followed the COL in the manual they would be impossible to feed from a magazine with out the danger of moving/dislodging the bullet.....so haven't even touched them.

Again, thanks; this information is backing up some of what I was thinking...so I don't feel like a totally hopeless loader (well not totally )...will see if I can get a second hand copy of the Speer manual out of interest.

What date is your action and barrel?

[Alpha1]

What info are you after from the speer manual I have a copy open in front of me.

[Blu]

Dougan, try and get the Speer # 14 Manual, that is the one with the two loads for the 6.5 Swede commercial and military. Hey mate like I already said, I would be more than happy to to scan any load data you want to PDF format and PM it to you, just let me know as it's no big deal to me. Anyways glad to be of help.

My rifle with all matching numbers is dated 1905.

Blu

[Blu]

Alpha 1, Is that the #14 Speer Manual you have?

Blu