death of police officers in manchester

[3bravo]

the appalling murder of two women police officers in the gmp area, has brought the usual suspects out of the woodwork to make capital out of their famillies grief and misery. Commisar Squires of the gcn, was on a late night, early morning interview on radio 4, venting the textbook bile "proven facts", that a national police data base of firearms holders names and addresses would ensure that a team of armed response officers would attend incidents where firearms may be at the premises. This seems to ignore the fact that a hand-grenade and possibly an automatic weapon were used, every tragedy is seen as another excuse to attack legitimate law abiding persons, and not to allow the facts and truth spoil some good anti gun propaganda. Let's hope that after the truth has emerged from Hillsborough that a courageous politician calls for the truth to be sifted from the Dunblane dross

[Blackstuff]

I'm thankful i haven't heard this clown, that's an instant pi$$-boiler

1/ Legal firearms were not used so such a register would not have helped
2/ The officers were unaware that the scumbag was in this property so even if he was in possession of legal guns registered to his house, they wouldn't have been flagged by a search on the property where he was hiding
3/ A "team of armed officers" weren't used for the call
4/ The database already exists, it's called the NFLMS which can be accessed by ANY officer via the PNC

What a cretinous moron.

[meles meles]

It's my belief that the fact our police are unarmed is a primary reason why the vast majority of us support them. We may not all like all the laws they enforce, but we appreciate the laws exist and the police are charged with maintaining the public peace and enforcing those laws. It's policing by consent, and the police thereby represent the needs of the public, not the demands of the state as is so often the case in other countries. I wouldn't want to change that and I understand the majority of the police also hold that view. They take risks on our behalf, and in return the vast majority of the population appreciate and support them.

The day it is considered unsafe for a policeman (woman) to walk the streets unarmed is the day that Joe Public too should be permitted to carry defensive arms. I think few us want to go down that route.

[IainWR]

"In the Office of Constable"

I, .. .. of .. .. do solemnly and sincerely declare and affirm that I will well and truly serve the Queen in the Office of Constable, with fairness, integrity, diligence and impartiality, upholding fundamental human rights and according equal respect to all people; and that I will, to the best of my power, cause the peace to be kept and preserved and prevent all offences against people and property; and that while I continue to hold the said office I will to the best of my skill and knowledge discharge all the duties thereof faithfully according to law.

Comment (not by me!)
The independent Office of Constable operates within, and is accountable to, the rule of law. The rule of law is the principle that no one is above the law. Perhaps the most important application of the rule of law is the principle that government authority is legitimately exercised only in accordance with written, publicly disclosed laws adopted and enforced in accordance with established procedural steps. The principle of the rule of law is intended to be a safeguard against arbitrary governance.
The law must be accessible, intelligible, clear and predictable and must apply equally to all. It must also afford adequate protection of fundamental human rights. It is the independent and impartial holder of the Office of Constable who is tasked with upholding and enforcing the law.

Comment by me
It is nearly unique to the UK, the Mother of Parliaments, the ancient birthplace of most of the principles of modern liberty, that our police are not routinely armed with lethal weapons. That is a fundamental issue between the citizen and the State, and not something to be given up lightly, particularly given that the citizen does not have the natural defences built into the finest of political documents ever written, the Constitution of the United States of America (my opinion as a student of the law). Remember that the UK has a huge separation between the practical power of the police and the apparatus of Government diktat, and that nearly all of our Chief Constables (who all uphold the Oath of the Office of Constable) guard that separation most jealously. I excuse the Met Commisioner on the grounds of his national policing responsibilities which require him to pay more attention to the Home Office than his County colleagues have to, and the Commissioner of PSNI on the grounds of the residual anti-terrorist issues there.

Two Constables are dead, and that is a tragedy, and a failure of procedure. It is not at all clear that it is a failure of principle. Freedom costs, and the price is not paid either by the beneficiaries or in money. Their sacrifice is in the most honourable cause; may it not be forgotten.

Iain

[3bravo]

last night on radio 5 Tony Livsey, Professor Peter Squires a representative of the gcn and professor of criminology at Brighton was again given unchallenged air time to vent his spleen and present facts that Joseph Goebbles would have been proud of. He ended his factual statement, unchallenged,by stating legal firearms, were frequently altered by sawing barrels off shotguns and filing serial numbers off section 1 firearms, he left it to the already rabid, anti shooting sports listener, to agree all fac and permit holders were merely criminals in training waiting for a suitable crime scene. Tony Livesey ended the programme by inviting the usual sychophants to phone in tonight (thursday) with their (supporting) comments, no doubt anyone who disagrees with gcn will not be picked to air their views.
This tragic incident is once again the clouds silver lining for the antis

[dromia]

That is just why we need intelligent active campaigning from our national bodies.

Stuff like this would be seen as an opportunity for any worthwhile pro legal gun ownership and shooting organisation.

[Blackstuff]

3bravo - If you are a member of BASC can you please email the details to the press team. If not can you PM the detials of the show to me and i'll send them to BASC

Thanks

[3bravo]

Thanks blackstuff just out of bed work nights,media informed

[Gaz]

Professor Peter Squires. He's the one who was claiming that shooting sports magazines are the equivalent of pornography a couple of weeks ago.

No surprises that he's one of the five members of Gill Marshall-Andrews'* "network". What we need to do is find out who the other 3 members are and challenge them, publicly, in a forum they cannot ignore or hide from, to justify their spiteful, emotion-driven views. Something like the Telegraph or the Spectator comes to mind.

As for arming the police - well, the police are the public and the public are the police, or so Sir Robert Peel tells us. Therefore, if the police are to routinely be armed for self defence, so the public must be (re) granted the same right.

*don't forget that Gill Marshall-Andrews' husband is none other than ex-Labour MP Bob Marshall-Andrews.

[Chuck]

Maybe our associations should be out the trap first in situtaion sliken this..with comment and press releases rather than letting the gutter press and deranged loonietunes like the GCN spout their lies and bile.