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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 6:22 pm 
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Hello
Lucky you..


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 7:06 pm 
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Location: Weston Super Mare
Home club or Range: Phoenix at Thorn. The tunnel at Charmouth, BWSS
nice find.

unfortunate its gone to the police and not the dealer first, as it may be gone.

It will qualify for 7.3 as its pre 1939, and as you have provenance you would be able to provide, especially if backed up by any documentation on it, even photos of your relatives with it?

deactivation is a crime.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:20 pm 
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Justwatching wrote:
"Firearms acquired from the original holder and no longer held as family heirlooms..."

The exclusion does not apply to your circumstances as your pistol is being held as a family heirloom.

Looks like it's pre-A1 revision, so quite early.


Thanks Justwatching, I agree I misread that. Still seems like a long shot but at least there is a possibility of keeping it within the guidance.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:24 pm 
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bradaz11 wrote:
nice find.

unfortunate its gone to the police and not the dealer first, as it may be gone.

It will qualify for 7.3 as its pre 1939, and as you have provenance you would be able to provide, especially if backed up by any documentation on it, even photos of your relatives with it?

deactivation is a crime.


Thanks bradaz11, I am still looking through some of the records so will see what pops up but think I would be very lucky to find any pictures! I did consider having it picked straight up by a dealer and in hindsight that may have been better, I assume this still would have been legal and they would have reported it to the police on my behalf then I would answer any follow up questions?

Cheers


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:45 am 
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Location: Weston Super Mare
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Steve12345 wrote:
bradaz11 wrote:
nice find.

unfortunate its gone to the police and not the dealer first, as it may be gone.

It will qualify for 7.3 as its pre 1939, and as you have provenance you would be able to provide, especially if backed up by any documentation on it, even photos of your relatives with it?

deactivation is a crime.


Thanks bradaz11, I am still looking through some of the records so will see what pops up but think I would be very lucky to find any pictures! I did consider having it picked straight up by a dealer and in hindsight that may have been better, I assume this still would have been legal and they would have reported it to the police on my behalf then I would answer any follow up questions?

Cheers


yeah pretty much, as long as they are a sec5 dealer of the right type, with capacity to hold it, then they could. Any RFD can accept any gun as a hand in, but they can't hang on to it if they are sec1 and it is sec 5. Just more chance of keeping it out the shredder and out of newspaper photos is all.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 2:38 pm 
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Location: Bisley
Home club or Range: NRA Bisley
Hi Steve

Your pistol should qualify as S7.3 . There are 11 sites in GB where S7.3 (Heritage) Pistols may be kept. Roughly where are you in the country?

Of course if you are in NI, IoM or CI there's less of a problem ...

Iain


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:45 pm 
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Steve12345 wrote:
Still seems like a long shot but at least there is a possibility of keeping it within the guidance.


Why do you say it's a long shot? Do you not think you're able to demonstrate its connection to your family and establish it as a trophy of war?

The section 5 authority would run you £206. Unfortunately, the police will want a further £88 for the FAC. The FAC lasts five years and costs £62 to renew there after. The section 5 authority doesn't have a prescribed term limit and should be open ended (contingent on you maintaining the FAC). You'd need to invest in a gun safe if you don't have one already.

Search your local police force + firearms licensing and you'll find a webpage with information about applying for the FAC. Web address below to apply for the section 5 authority.

https://www.firearms-licensing.homeoffi ... s5/privacy

Speaking of long shots, section 7(3)...

I'm not saying it's a no, but it's far from a sure thing. You're not a collector for starters (section 9.19 of HO guidance "...a section 7(3) application depends upon the firearm forming a part of a collection"). The gun also needs to meet one of the following criteria - historical importance; aesthetic quality; technical interest; particular rarity. Does this route meet your objectives in any case? It would be entombed at a historic site where you (and not other member's of your family) could occasionally visit it.

I don't think deactivation should be entirely ruled out as an option, either. I'm a collector and I understand people's objection to deactivation, but in the eyes of a collector, your gun is one of thousands just like it. To you family though, it's one of a kind. Perhaps keeping it and preserving your family's martial history is more important than preserving the gun's mechanical integrity.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:31 pm 
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IainWR wrote:
Hi Steve

Your pistol should qualify as S7.3 . There are 11 sites in GB where S7.3 (Heritage) Pistols may be kept. Roughly where are you in the country?

Of course if you are in NI, IoM or CI there's less of a problem ...

Iain


Thank Iain, I have had a look, my nearest site would be Bisley which isn't really that far from me. It's something I will look into, I don't think I would qualify for 7.3 if I'm honest. I'm open to someone else having it with a 7.3 but then as others have said it would mean it's locked away and I won't ever see it..


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:41 pm 
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Justwatching wrote:
Steve12345 wrote:
Still seems like a long shot but at least there is a possibility of keeping it within the guidance.


Why do you say it's a long shot? Do you not think you're able to demonstrate its connection to your family and establish it as a trophy of war?

The section 5 authority would run you £206. Unfortunately, the police will want a further £88 for the FAC. The FAC lasts five years and costs £62 to renew there after. The section 5 authority doesn't have a prescribed term limit and should be open ended (contingent on you maintaining the FAC). You'd need to invest in a gun safe if you don't have one already.

Search your local police force + firearms licensing and you'll find a webpage with information about applying for the FAC. Web address below to apply for the section 5 authority.

https://www.firearms-licensing.homeoffi ... s5/privacy

Speaking of long shots, section 7(3)...

I'm not saying it's a no, but it's far from a sure thing. You're not a collector for starters (section 9.19 of HO guidance "...a section 7(3) application depends upon the firearm forming a part of a collection"). The gun also needs to meet one of the following criteria - historical importance; aesthetic quality; technical interest; particular rarity. Does this route meet your objectives in any case? It would be entombed at a historic site where you (and not other member's of your family) could occasionally visit it.

I don't think deactivation should be entirely ruled out as an option, either. I'm a collector and I understand people's objection to deactivation, but in the eyes of a collector, your gun is one of thousands just like it. To you family though, it's one of a kind. Perhaps keeping it and preserving your family's martial history is more important than preserving the gun's mechanical integrity.


The reason I say it's a long shot is just because there doesn't seem to be many people who have done it when I have looked on forums. I also mentioned it on the day when the pistol was picked up and didn't seem like it an option people were keen to look at. I get the impression it was more aimed directly at the person who acquired the item as a trophy, although I do agree with your previous comments that there are circumstances where it could be handed down. I do think I would be able to prove it's link to our family.

You are right in that this 1911 will mean more to me than anyone else, but then I guess you could argue it's no more special then some of the other items I have inherited. Although this was partly what I wanted to know and why I came to enthusiasts yourself, I had no idea how common / rare these pistols are, if there are any special models, anything to look out for etc.. On that note you have reminded me on a question I meant to ask, the Douglas that has been engraved on the side (think you can see it in one of the pics) I assume that is not standard and someone has added that on after it was issue to them?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:45 am 
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It certainly is a 1911 model , serial number suggests it was made in 1914 as a commercial model , not part of a military order .
It would have been nice to know if it had any sort of uk proof marks or uk military acceptance marks .
That would have at least indicated it being in the UK officially .

My own 1911A1 was donated to the UK by the American Committee for the Defense of British Homes . It had an arrow head stamp that showed it had been accepted by the military here , and I think it was proofed at its acceptance as well.

It was issued to the SOE , the user was wounded in Italy, he gave it to a tank commander who later joined the police force before selling it to me in 1976 .
Sadly it was handed in and destroyed.

Your 1911 really should be preserved if possible .


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